Test drove a Mustang GT just for the hell of it...

[sean]

White 02 Mustang GT convertible, 54 miles, new/unsold/leftover from last year.

I was actually hoping for a loud bang from the engine when I cranked it. Sounded soft and cheap like a Chevy Cavalier turning on. My Si's HKS exhaust is louder than this.

Let's start off saying DAMN that clutch is stiff! You could work your calves out with this thing I tell ya. Pulling out of the parking lot the asthmatic first gear begged to go to the next gear at about 15 mph. During the drive I lightly rested my hand on the shift knob and talk about force feedback, the shifter stick and knob rattled like a plug in dildo. This thing felt like it had no go. Supposedly it does 14's with the 4.6. The shifts were long as hell and imprecise. Many times you felt like the lever was in the right slot and what do you know, you let up too quick and the car shakes violently. At the few red lights we got too the engine idled so rough it felt like an 80's GM car at 90,000 miles/on it's last legs.

All in all, this car sucked and felt incredibly heavy and slow. Very dissappointing. I eventually got the salesman off my back and left. Driving home was like light and day. All you EP owners would rejoice to know how smooth our transmissions and engines work together. No shaking/rattling felt whatsoever. With my 2 mods alone, my car felt faster. Tell me I'm high but hey that thing really sucked that bad. No regrets with buying the Si, no sir. All of you should be grateful you drive a Honda and not some domestic POS.

[klik]

No Comment

[Tenacious G]

i hope you went home right after and washed/showered to get the Ford-stink off you (ala Crying Game). look into antibacterial soap. rinse. repeat.

[Dunrick]

Its not just you.....My friends 5.0 mustang that has clutch/intake/wide wheels/shortshifter/exhaust didn't feel fast at all....And talk about a hard clutch, I was like sweating driving it......I got in my car and the clutch was just floored immediately. They are faster cars, but they sure dont feel like it huh....Its like a more gradual pull, not a BAM pull like our cars.....He can run mid 14's and I swear it doesn't feel fast at all. The car feels like it is made out of rubber, that is all I can say...the steering wheel is all wobbly, blah, I dont like mustangs. Fast cars they can be though. peace

[ADAMnQuickCIVIC]

somehow i doubt your ep is even nearly as fast as that GT...
the sticks run 14 flat...
some good drivers even dip into the 13's....stock.
sure you werent driving a v6? lol

[cpu519]

Yeah, Mustangs have always had a stiff clutch with a long throw. I put a Ford Motorsport clutch in my 5.0 and it was even stiffer. Couldn't compare it to anything because it was the only car I drove. When my friend drove it, that's the first thing he noticed - clutch was stiff as hell. Domestics have a blunderbuss approach, crude but get the job done, and cheap. Imports are precise, everything fits, and nothing can touch them technologically. My Mustang was an 89. I haven't driven any new models, but it seems nothing has changed.

[sean]

Yup, modular V8 with a gray GT emblem on the trunk hatch. If it were a V6 than shit, $24,500 is a big asking price. Also, gotta love the Mexican made transmission.

[FirstImport02Si]

I'd trade my car in for that stang 7 days a week. Not a bad price either. Convertibles are badass.

[IceD out N CALI]

doesnt sound like you had a very good experience with it:o

[Bill Miller]

I just got out of a '01 Cobra and into a Si. Reason? Gas mileage. And the fact that Honda has a great reputation for quality, so I went with it.

If you want to think your Honda is better than a Mustang, that's fine. We all know the adage about opinions. ;) But don't think for a moment that your little Honda is faster than a new GT. And forget the Cobra. Anyone that knows anything about Mustangs knows that you change the shifter shortly after getting one. My Honda shifter doesn't feel anywhere near as precise as the tri-ax I had in the Cobra. Yes, the Honda clutch has a lighter pedal feel. Contribute that to the fact that it is hydraulic and that it doesn't have to transfer half the torque a Mustang clutch does. The first time I drove my Si, I almost put the clutch pedal through the floor. I thought it was pretty wimpy, but got used to it quickly.

The first gear in the Si is VERY short. Similar to a Cobra 6-speed with 4.10s in the rearend. Unless you consider taching along at 4k in first ok...

The Si isn't quick, sorry. I've had quick cars. Actually, I don't consider anything slower than 12s (on street tires) quick, but that's just me. My Si gets out of it's own way, and with it's reduced weight, is pleasant to drive around curves. It doesn't even come close to the cornering prowess of my Cobra, but then that car wasn't stock, so I'm not comparing apples to apples.

I like my Si, but when I finish school (mid-lifer changing careers) I will likely get another Cobra or maybe a RX-7 for serious corner carving. I've owned both, several times over.

[sean]

Reliability? Insurance? Those take their toll on every Ford owner...I didn't say my Si is faster than an SVT. Yet I can pick up a used NSX that will kill that Mustang for that much. There is a stark difference between a GT and an SVT, not only in power, but price. $24k going to $41k. $17,000 difference. Also you need to take into account that the HP per liter on the Ford looks silly compared to a Honda engine, albeit supercharger. If you look on car-stats.com an auto GT does the QM in 15.6 despite an engine more than two and a half times bigger, which is an even match for my Si.

If you'd like a good laugh go take a look at where the Mustang's transmission is made.

[Bill Miller]

Wasn't picking on you, if I came across that way, sorry.

Ah, no, I've owned a NSX. Underpowered, lousy suspension, and way overpriced. I've met/talked to guys who road race them, and they have to mod them just as much as the Mustang owners do, but it costs them more because 'it's a NSX'. Ouch.

My RX-7 ate NSXs for lunch at Laguna Seca every time I showed up. It also ate Vipers. But then it wasn't stock, but it sure cost less than either of those. :D

Actually, I don't care where my transmission is made. My T-56 6-speed was made in Mexico. My Si tranny is made in Japan. As I've seen junk from both countries, I fail to see any difference, other than the T-56 is way more stout and heavier. I've had 7 Mustangs, 3 of those being Saleens. The reason I like them? They've been very reliable for me. Even when pushing 600 hp. 'Course I could have just been one of the lucky ones, but then my experiences are the only ones that count. To me. ;)

I paid 24k for my '01 Cobra, used. I put another 8k in it. Not bad for the benefits derived. But, as I said previously, I decided to get rid of it in favor of something more thrifty at the pumps. I love the seats in my Si, as they remind me of the Recaros I had in the S351s, and the interior is roomy enough for my 6'3", 250 lb. frame. I didn't buy it because it is sporty. If you believe yours to be, great, I'm happy for you. I'm very happy with mine, I just don't think it's a sports car is all.

Smile on down the road!

[sean]

You didn't upset me, it's okay. You're definitely one of the more polite people I've spoken on here with. I admire that.

As for the RX-7, mind you this engine, made by the Dr. Wankel of Germany, was designed for airplanes and retrofitted for a car. As you and I know this engine requires a rebuild every 50k miles (apex seal). Not a plus side. But respectfully powerful for it's smallish size.

That SVT you picked up used depriciated something awful for it to be that cheap, but then again this is due to the fact it's a domestic and not exactly known for either build quality or reliability. You are definitely lucky yours didn't create serious frequent problems. My friend's SVT is on it's third radiator at only 110,000 miles. I know this because I had to drive him to the dealership to get this done twice. God knows what other parts have broke on him since then that he's too embarassed to tell me about.

Sure the Si isn't that powerful. As a matter of fact it's de-tuned so as not to take sales away from the Type-S RSX which really makes this small engine shine.

Japanese transmissions trash? Please, they're world reknowned for making the best transmissions. Volvo of Sweden and Jaguar of England (now Ford) use Japanese transmissions. Interesting that they can't produce a quality one for their own cars nowadays. How about the Jaguar's Nippon-Denso ECM? No trash is made in Japan.

Also, was your NSX a Targa? That thing does 13.2's. I have a hard time seeing an RX-7 doing better.

[Tenacious G]

question:

why was this thread started in the Engine section? seems more like Off Topic kind of topic.

just wunderin'

[cpu519]

I still have my Mustang. I had to do a lot to it to get rid of the overall rubberyness: shifter, seats, steering wheel, subframe connectors, front camber plates, plastic bushings for the steering rack and front control arms, and replaced the rear control arms with units made with spherical bearings. It handled tight as hell with race springs and Koni Sport shocks. It is very crude compared with any Honda, and not for everyday use. Mine's an 89, the new models are built with a stiffer body and the new engines make at least 50% more power with less displacement, without a supercharger. New Mustangs (not SVT models) seem to be soft all around, just look at how high they are, but they're still fast. Once they're modded, they are monstrous. The 1/4 mile times that seem kinda slow are probably because of traction issues.

[Bill Miller]

Originally posted by sean

>As for the RX-7, mind you this engine, made by the Dr. Wankel >of Germany, was designed for airplanes and retrofitted for a car. >As you and I know this engine requires a rebuild every 50k >miles (apex seal). Not a plus side. But respectfully powerful for >it's smallish size.


Good friend of mine just has the engine rebuilt in his '93 RX-7, for the first time, after 113k miles. I rebuilt mine at 78k simply because I was building it into a road racer. The only people I knew of who had to rebuild theirs that frequently didn't know how to properly tune or take care of it.

>That SVT you picked up used depriciated something awful for it >to be that cheap, but then again this is due to the fact it's a >domestic and not exactly known for either build quality or >reliability. You are definitely lucky yours didn't create serious >frequent problems. My friend's SVT is on it's third radiator at >only 110,000 miles. I know this because I had to drive him to >the dealership to get this done twice. God knows what other >parts have broke on him since then that he's too embarassed to >tell me about.

It sold new for $32k, It was listed one year later for $26.5, I got a good deal because I knew the sales manager. I got lucky.

Talk about lousy resale, have you priced a used Si? ;)

>Japanese transmissions trash? Please, they're world reknowned >for making the best transmissions. Volvo of Sweden and Jaguar >of England (now Ford) use Japanese transmissions. Interesting >that they can't produce a quality one for their own cars >nowadays. How about the Jaguar's Nippon-Denso ECM? No >trash is made in Japan.

Not what I said. I said that I've bought trash from Japan and Mexico, not to mention other countries, so the simple fact that my tranny is made offshore won't even cause me to blink. Best tranny I've ever used was a Richmond sequential 6-speed. Very nice.

>Also, was your NSX a Targa? That thing does 13.2's. I have a >hard time seeing an RX-7 doing better.

Yup, and my RX-7 did over a full second faster on street tires. It's very easy to do with those cars. I only took it to the drag racing track twice as I'm not a draggie fan. A friends did 10s on drag radials. With a car set up for road racing.

Looks like we're upsetting some, so I'll stop here.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by sean
..................Driving home was like light and day. ............................
you mean night and day.....
anyway, yeah, it's going to have a stiffer clutch due to so much more torque....I would assume.
Get your butt dyno checked out...it's faster than your ep.
And of course a fart-can is going to be louder than a stock GT.....that's pretty sad when you think about it....on your part

[Dunrick]

I think the point of this thread was misinterpreted. I know a mustang will smoke me. It doesn't feel faster, thats my point. I think sean feels the same way. Thats just what I got from him. Peace

[02blksi]

thanks , next time post this in off topic or general forum... :) - joe.