The Jackson Racing Supercharger Kit

[JRPower]

Hello I am Little Oscar and would like to help with all your questions.

The kit so far:

-Around the price of the RSX-S kit when released.

-Release Date set for around the end of August.

^Will Be Updated!!!^

Any more questions? Post or e-mail me at jrhorsepower@yahoo.com .

[SF-SI-02]

I would like to buy your supercharger. I have also been thinking of replacing my current cold air intake, what will be compatible with your sch? I don't want to drop $300 now and have to replace it in august for compatability.

Also, you guys rock, but read all your hate mail here, I think you should take the time to respond to many of the negative comments and concerns about your sch especially those that compare your sch with other forced induction kits on the market. There are a lot of people eager to drop either your kit or the turbo, I recommend you visit this board quasi-regularly and get these easy marketing points for free. I'd do it for you, but then again, I missed the sponsorship deadline and don't feel like waiting a year, correct me if I am wrong ;)

L8r

[Quicksilver]

I've got a few general questions for you on the 02-03 Si kit:

What kind of boost levels will the kits be pushing?

What are the differences between the street version and the race version?

If a person were to purchase the street version and later purchase the race version, would that be possible and what would be the additional cost (ballpark)?

Are both versions CARB legal?

For the dyno charts on your website, were the before and after charts based upon stock vs. stock with JRSC, or were there additional bolt-ons (i.e intake/header/exhaust) added to get the "after" numbers? The recent Honda Tuning article lead me to believe that it had a JR race header installed. Are you or will you be making race headers for the Si?

Would your company be up for a group buy on one of the inital allocations of superchargers for the Si? If not through you, I'm guessing it would have to be through one of your distributors.

That should do it for now. I appreciate you showing up and answering our questions. I'm sorry if I caused any confusion about who had responsed to me. That whole Sr., Jr., III thing has always confused me. :o

Kurtis

[JRPower]

In this kit, the throttle body is only moved slightly, causing all of the common intake systems to be compatible with our kits. We have personally tested intakes form DC Sports, AEM, and Injen which were all compatible with our kit.

I try to drop by these forums as often as I can, but I oversee Focaljet and EP Hatch. It is very hard to continue pushing forward on projects (Si Kit), answer e-mail, and answer posts on Focaljet and EP Hatch. I will try the best I can to answer all your questions, and I will try to focus on this thread, so please remind people in other threads, that say something negative or have a question, to post it in this thread.

The Boost Level in the CARB Legal Street Kit is 5+ psi.

The Street Version is just like our normal kit. It will be CARB-Legal and ready to run right out of the box.

The Race Version will have many add-ons. The Race kti will not be CARB legal. Jackson Racing has not decided yet on every specific thing, but two things have been decided on. First, there will be bigger injectors provided with the kit. Also, there will be an ECU Upgrade. Other aspects of the kit will be similar to the Civic Si present in the July issue of Honda Tuning.

It is certainly going to be possible to buy the Race version after the Street version. The price for the Race kit has not been determined, not even a ballpark, because not all the parts of the kit have been determined.

The dyno charts on Jackson Racing.com are seperated. The Street version dyno is with only the supercharger. The Race version dyno is the setup we used in the magazine article.

We will be offering an Si Header, with all the same features as the RSX-S header. I will post when they are offically shipping.

Group buys I have no idea on and you will have to go through our website for further information on Sales. You can also call 1-888-888-4079.

Don't worry about the confusion between my father and me. It happens!

[Blackapino85]

so the 206whp that the si in honda tuning had was off of the race version? and its not carb legal right? what is the hp rating on the street version?

[JRPower]

That is the prototype race version. The race version pieces have not been set in stone yet.

The race version will not be CARB legal.

The dyno sheets of the Si, Street and Race Version, are at Jackson Racing.com. Here is the link to the charts... http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailspage.html

[esmith13]

I take all this talk to mean that if the kit is not CARB legal, it won't pass state emissions testing???

I live in PA, and I'm trying to find out if it being CARB legal means anything to me or not??

If NOT being CARB legal just means an annual penalty, I'm OK with that, but if I could not legally drive it on the street at all with out a CARB cert., I need to know this.

Any1 know the answer, or where to find it???

Eric

[greenguy]

Originally posted by esmith13
I take all this talk to mean that if the kit is not CARB legal, it won't pass state emissions testing???

I live in PA, and I'm trying to find out if it being CARB legal means anything to me or not??

If NOT being CARB legal just means an annual penalty, I'm OK with that, but if I could not legally drive it on the street at all with out a CARB cert., I need to know this.

Any1 know the answer, or where to find it???

Eric
No! The "C" in CARB stands for California.

[Quicksilver]

On the dyno chart for the street version, it shows an increased rev limit (7250 vs stock 6900 or so). Will the increased revs be included in the street kit? I was under the impression that only the race version would have increased limits.

[QuicksilverSIR]

Also a question re the dyno - yours shows a base hp of about 125 and a supercharged hp of 178 (street version). Other dynos I have seen show a base hp of 130 to 140. Recognizing that different dynos show different results, should we be focussing on the percentage gain, not the raw numbers? E.G. on the JR dyno run, 178 over 125 is a 42.2 percent increase in hp, so if on a different dyno the base hp was, say, 138 would that same dyno show a supercharged hp of 196 hp (as in 138 * 1.424)?

Also, how technically astute do you need to be to install the street system yourself? Could a fairly experienced amateur do it? No special tools or tuning equipment required?

Thanks.

[Quicksilver]

Also, will a Hondata intake gasket fit with the supercharger? I'm guessing no, since the engine compartment already looks cramped with the supercharger.

[trk]

Will the current hondata si flash be compatible (drivable) with the street jrsc?

[Jodster]

Will you guys be offering an upgraded boost kit later down the road for the SI JRSC?

[Hondata]

We took the race version of the RSX-S high output SC kit to a smog test station in California and the results were indistinguishable from a stock RSX.

The Hondata gasket will probably fit.

The current Hondata reflash will not be compatible with the street kit. You will either need to return the ECU to stock or upgrade to the race version, the specifications of which have not been set yet.

[trk]

Originally posted by Hondata
We took the race version of the RSX-S high output SC kit to a smog test station in California and the results were indistinguishable from a stock RSX.

The Hondata gasket will probably fit.

The current Hondata reflash will not be compatible with the street kit. You will either need to return the ECU to stock or upgrade to the race version, the specifications of which have not been set yet.

... shit, after spending $730+ (tax, shipping, flash, gasket, etc) we better get a deal on the second reflash --- :confused: :eek: -- seriously.

I'm planning on buying the street SC kit ... getting smogged and then getting the reflash to the race SC ... buying some injectors... etc.

[HondaMan]

Wow, I'm liking this JRSC news and the Hondata ECU flash for it. Probably will be a long time till I can afford it all (need to win the Lotto). No CARB issues here, so the race kit would be the way to go. :D

[EP33]

1. On the race version you smogged would it still need a CARB# in order to have the smog performed even though it passed?

2. What smog shop is this?:D

[chet]

Glad to see that Jackson Racing joined us here at EPhatch!! I have been very interested in the JRSC for some time now. I am curious if you will be able to put together a groupbuy for EPhatchers here. I think you will get a great response. But, I would like to see better increases in torque. There's a nice increase in whp, but to spend close to $4000 . .. . .I'm curious if there has been any more R & D in getting a little more out of the SC before it actually goes into production.


EDIT Disregard the g-buy ?, I missed it in the earlier post, sorry.

[JRPower]

I am sorry for the late response everyone, but we have been working hard on getting kits out to production.

We do all of our dyno testing on our in-house Dynojet Dyno.

To install the Jackson Racing kit you do not need special tools and a person with some mechanical experience could tackle the installation. No hand tuning is required. The Power Card is provided on the Street Kit.

The race kit is being considered the Stage 1 Race kit. That means other stages will be involved meaning... the thought of more boost.

I am sorry but I am unable to speak on a group buy. Please contact Jackson Racing Main at 1-888-888-4079 or at www.jacksonracing.com . To stop the process of production, Turn-Key, reliable, O.E. quality engineering now right before introduction to increase boost would not be a good idea. the kit is reliable and makes plenty of power. The numbers don't match with the superior performance of this kit.

Thank you for your time and anymore questions you have please e-mail me or post. jrhorsepower@yahoo.com

[02SilverSiHB]

damn, I kinda want to go with this, it's easier to install and safer as long as I stay at the stock boost. I'd be in the 14's for sure, all I'd need.

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by JRPower
I am sorry but I am unable to speak on a group buy. Please contact Jackson Racing Main at 1-888-888-4079 or at www.jacksonracing.com.

I'll be working out the details about posting a group buy here with DownTheHatch (the owner of this site). After I get his requirements, I'll be contacting you guys to see if we can get something set up.

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by Quicksilver
Also, will a Hondata intake gasket fit with the supercharger? I'm guessing no, since the engine compartment already looks cramped with the supercharger.

even though the Hondata guys said it would probably fit, i doubt it will do you much good since increasing the air pressure in the intake manifold from the SC will heat it up.

also, to Little O, is there any reason your dynos of the stock K20A3 showed such low power? ... 125 whp and 116 tq or something like that. was it a hot day? brand new engine? there are members on here who dynoed closer to 135-140 whp and 120 tq.

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
even though the Hondata guys said it would probably fit, i doubt it will do you much good since increasing the air pressure in the intake manifold from the SC will heat it up.


I don't think the Eaton roots blower actually compresses the air. Centrifugal superchargers (like a Vortech) or an Autorotor twin-screw supercharger (like a Kenne Bell) compress the air. The roots blower is still forced induction, but not a true compressor like the others. You'll still get more heat than you normally would on the intake due to the fact that you now have rotating assemblies that weren't there before. But since you're not compressing the air, which generates heat, the JRSC should benefit from the intake gasket.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Quicksilver


I don't think the Eaton roots blower actually compresses the air. Centrifugal superchargers (like a Vortech) or an Autorotor twin-screw supercharger (like a Kenne Bell) compress the air. The roots blower is still forced induction, but not a true compressor like the others. You'll still get more heat than you normally would on the intake due to the fact that you now have rotating assemblies that weren't there before. But since you're not compressing the air, which generates heat, the JRSC should benefit from the intake gasket.
the honda gasket will help the JRSC, hondata has used it in the past. They used that, 450cc DSM injectors, a resistor pack (from an older civic) to compensate for the different type of injectors, injector clips, stock fuel pump, stock fuel rail, stock fuel regulater, and their ecu upgrade to run the JRSC perfectly on the B series.

[D16Y8_Turbo]

Availability of your kit is still projected for late August? Since JR "sees" interest in the Si kit, maybe production will be pushed up? :D

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by Quicksilver


I don't think the Eaton roots blower actually compresses the air. Centrifugal superchargers (like a Vortech) or an Autorotor twin-screw supercharger (like a Kenne Bell) compress the air. The roots blower is still forced induction, but not a true compressor like the others. You'll still get more heat than you normally would on the intake due to the fact that you now have rotating assemblies that weren't there before. But since you're not compressing the air, which generates heat, the JRSC should benefit from the intake gasket.

ah, i see. i stand corrected then.

[JRPower]

I have no idea on the conditions during the dyno of the Stock JR Civic Si. I wil try and see if I can find any information on that.

The JRSC does not mind having the Hondata gasket there and would like it.

I am sorry, but you cannot just simply push production up because of interest. The reason for late August is because testing and other aspects of the whole kit are being waited on. Everything on the kit must be perfect and Oscar must OK eveything. If he does not like something about it, he will hold production.

The kit if projected late August. You guys might get lucky and it might get released slightly earlier, but no promises can be made on an earlier production date.

[EP33]

You all just take your time with this kit because if something ain't right and people have purchased it. . .can you imagine the BITCHING that would take place???


Get it right y'all Get it right.

[JRPower]

Yes, and that is exactly why we make sure everything is perfect.

Ire over not being released is beter than ire over problems with the kit.

[Quicksilver]

Okay, I contacted Jackson Racing today about a potential group buy. We'd need to go through an authorized distributor (any listed on their website). I'm thinking that Summit is our best bet since they did one for the Focus people when it was released. Plus they're a HUGE distributor, so they're our best bet for a lowest price.

Before I go contacting them, how much interest is there in a group buy? As stated earlier in the thread, pricing should be close to the SVT Focus kit (around $2700-2800), but exact figures have still not been released. Figure with a group buy you'll be able to save around $50-200 off that price. I'm thinking we'd need a minimum or 5-10 people. Let me know how many people are seriously interested in purchasing one of these, so that I know whether or not to follow up with Summit.

Kurtis

[chet]

If the price ends up being in that 25 to 2700 range, I could get it this year. Otherwise I will have to wait. But I am definitely in if the price is in that general area.

[I SELL HONDAS]

@ 2500 i'd want to know abot the race upgrade too.
cost that is.
What about discounts for repeat customers?

:D

:D

[I SELL HONDAS]

this could be my second blower from jackson!!

[Jodster]

I have a question about those of us that do a motor swap. I'm in the process of getting a K24 motor to swap in my EP. And I plan on going with the JRSC on the new motor. Would the basic SI kit be ok on the K24? I know you guy have put the JRSC on a k24 with the K20A2 head, but you didn't specify which JRSC it was.

[I SELL HONDAS]

my GUESS is that the k20 blower is too small to be efficient.

just a hunch.

[JRPower]

In our motor swap, we used the basic Si kit, with Hondata tuning and a custom pulley. The kit fittment was good, but since the block is taller, the top of our inlet casting, and one allen head bolt rub on the hood. So in order to fix that, cut a hole in the bottom bracing of the hood and it will be fine. We recommend using Hasport Motor Mounts for your motor swap.

Tuning for your K24 will be completely different than a Civic Si. You will have to have tuning done by Hondata to have a perfect setup.

If you use a Base Civic Si pulley, you will be running less boost than what the K20 would. You will have to make a custom pulley for adquate boost.

The K24 blower woudl be best with the JR62. Anything smaller or bigger would be inefficent

Happy Driving!

[Jodster]

Are you guys going to make a JRSC kit for the K24 motor?

[D16Y8_Turbo]

Any news about final shipping dates?

[Tenacious G]

We really appreciate you keeping us updated, Little O. This definately has piqued my interest in the JRSC.

[JRPower]

K24 Kit... Classified. ;) IF a K24 kit is made, it will be a while.

No news on Final shipping dates. Final production precautions are under way and no date has been set.

I am sorry for the delayed responses, but I am trying very hard to make sure the kits are perfect. I get caught up in doing other things and need to get back here to answer your questions. Thank you, and I am glad you are looking in to our kit.

[JRPower]

Please feel free to ask more questions everyone.

[Quicksilver]

I think we're all waiting for the same thing:

-Release Date
-What's included (both street and race)
-Pricing (including the race upgrade cost)
-Final Production dyno numbers

Any idea when you're distributors will have pricing? I called Jegs and Summit, but both had no idea at this point.

[ArcanaRacing]

I just spoke with a JR salesperson, and they told me that the EP kit is pushed back again to sometime in September. I hope to become a JR dealer by then and will do my best to offer a group buy when the kit is released. My name will be on the list!

[PogoFX]

JRPower,

What exactly makes the Hondata reflash incompatible with the JRSC? Is it the timing advance, the extra revs, or what? The extra RPMs would be nice to keep. In other words, would a Hondata reflash that just raised the rev limit work with the JRSC.

I plan on buying the JRSC street version, but hate the fact that I may have wasted my money on Hondata in the long run.:(

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Quicksilver
I think we're all waiting for the same thing:

-Release Date
-What's included (both street and race)
-Pricing (including the race upgrade cost)
-Final Production dyno numbers

Any idea when you're distributors will have pricing? I called Jegs and Summit, but both had no idea at this point.
I just received this from mossperformance...it's for the type s, but I'd assume it's about the same for us

This Jackson Racing RSX Type-S supercharger system will be available in two configurations. The first is a CARB approved street system running 5psi of boost. The Second is our Race system also running 5psi of boost but using 440cc injectors and a JR Tuned/Hondata flashed ECU program. By flashing the ECU, JR and Hondata were able to adjust cam phasing, ignition timing and raise the rev limiter. All this results in another 40+ HP to the wheels. Our Race system is not CARB exempt.

[02SilverSiHB]

oh and the pricing it shows:
Part Number: 989-550 Reg: $4,295.00 Discount price: $2,699.95 Jackson Racing RSX 'S' Supercharger System - Street Version

Part Number: 989-552 $5,795.00 $3,895.95 Jackson Racing RSX 'S' Supercharger System - Race Version


Sorry if this info is older than shyt, I've paying more attetion to turbos lately.

[PogoFX]

What kind of noise does the JRSC make? Idle, cruise, WOT?

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by PogoFX
What kind of noise does the JRSC make? Idle, cruise, WOT?
I had one before, and at idle and cruise, no sound from the jrsc. At WOT it has this amazing sound words can't describe. Sounds like a damn space ship taking off :D it's a whirlling deep, but slightly high at the same time pitch....hard to explain anyone else?

[TripleJ02]

Its a high pitched whistle.... Pull next to a big ass truck on the highway... That whistle you hear is a supercharger.
Its a pretty cool sound if you ask me :D

[I SELL HONDAS]

99% of the thrucks on the road are turbo diesels, you are hearing a turbo "spool-up" that is to say build pressure or boost.

But my jrsc at wot sounds like a muffeled blender that is running at the same rpm as the engine. VERY COOL.


:cool:

[PogoFX]

Thanks for the input fellas. That all seems in line with what others at clubrsx have said about the sound. I personally just don't care for a loud car (i.e. fart can exhaust). This sounds like something I can live with, especially if there's no droning at highway speed.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by PogoFX
Thanks for the input fellas. That all seems in line with what others at clubrsx have said about the sound. I personally just don't care for a loud car (i.e. fart can exhaust). This sounds like something I can live with, especially if there's no droning at highway speed.
oh yeah, it's not a kind of sound that will bother you and drown out your radio.

[inlineracing]

I have two questions and I hope they are not repeats;

Will the JRSC work with the current HONDATA Flash program?

Will it be compatible with the new VAFC2?

I just can't wait untill this becomes avaiable.

Thank you
E.

[Makross]

hondata flash is recommended when you get the supercharger

[ArcanaRacing]

Originally posted by Makross
hondata flash is recommended when you get the supercharger

I believe that there is a JRSC-specific flash program, though.

[Tenacious G]

yeah, the JRSC Race version includes a hondata ecu flash. but i don't think the cost to reflash current hondata applications are was discussed.

the JRSC seems to fit my needs as far as the EP is concerned. too bad i'm unemployed right now.

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by inlineracing
Will the JRSC work with the current HONDATA Flash program?


Unless you upgrade to the race version, which includes a JRSC-specific ECU flash, then no. The ignition timing is too far advanced for forced induction and nitrous applications, so you'd get detonation. However, the upgrade to the race version should be cheaper for you. I don't think a solid price had been set when the RSX people asked Jackson Racing on ClubRSX. If I had to make an educated guess, I would say you'd probably save around $400 off of the race version upgrade price.

I too am eagerly awaiting the kit's release. Darn Greddy for releasing their turbo before JR releases their supercharger. It's awefully tempting to go turbo, but I'll wait. A supercharger may not have the peak power of a turbo, but I want the everyday drivability of the low end torque on the roots blower. Zero lag baby! ;)

What's the latest word Oscar?

[MoodySi]

I thought this was supposed to be released already. I wonder what problems have surfaced.

[chet]

I wouldn't necessarily say they're having problems. From what Little Oscar said, Big Oscar is quite the perfectionist when it comes to their products. . .If that's the case, I don't mind waiting a bit longer. Although I can't hardly stand it anymore. I think the JRSC will be great for auto-x w/ the low end torque. Maybe I can catch the two guys that always seem to beat me out by 1 or two seconds. Hopefully he's been away from EPhatch due to the finishing touches being applied and tested on the EP. I am hoping they were able to get a little more torque too.

[JRPower]

Hello, sorry for the delayed response, but I have been very busy. Let me see if I can answer your questions...

I have heard claims the kit is already out. That is false.

The computer in the Race kit needs a new flash because the supercharger want things slightly different from NA. Please ask Hondata for more information on why.

At cruise, the supercharger is undetected, only when you roll into the throttle from a cruise state will you here it. If you have an air filter you will hear everytime you are on the gas a sweet low sound; that is the air filter sucking very hard. Wonderful!:)

The sound is not bothersome.

WOT, the blower whines with the sound of a jet.

No, big diesel trucks use turbos. Top Fuel Dragsters and Funny Cars use Roots blowers.

VAFC2 has not been tested with our product and Jackson Racing recommends using only their electronics or Hondata electronics.

The process of putting kits in final production is very tough and strenuous. Yes, Oscar wants his product perfect.


Hopefully he's been away from EPhatch due to the finishing touches being applied and tested on the EP.

Quite so. Everyday driving to see if over time anything occurs is hard when needing to get things to production. So our car has been the primary driver to get things sorted and to see if any problems arise. Thank you guys for being patient, and I will try to keep things up-to-date.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by JRPower
I have heard claims the kit is already out. That is false.



Super_si_45 says he's seen one already..how!?
Here's his posts:
http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212075#post212075

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212144#post212144

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=213035#post213035



Originally posted by JRPower

WOT, the blower whines with the sound of a jet.
that's a good description. Exactly how it sounds.

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by 02SilverSiHB


Super_si_45 says he's seen one already..how!?
Here's his posts:
http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212075#post212075

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212144#post212144

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=213035#post213035

he's probably confusing it w/ something else. and judging by how defensive he gets, he's probably full of it too.

[super_si_45]

Originally posted by Tenacious G


he's probably confusing it w/ something else. and judging by how defensive he gets, he's probably full of it too.

who the hell is this kid? i dont get defensive, and by the way, if u could read, yes i was mistaking it for another kit, but thank you for asking ass

[NamingException]

Originally posted by super_si_45


who the hell is this kid? i dont get defensive, and by the way, if u could read, yes i was mistaking it for another kit, but thank you for asking ass

Heh heh. This is the funniest post I've read in a while.

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by super_si_45


who the hell is this kid? i dont get defensive, and by the way, if u could read, yes i was mistaking it for another kit, but thank you for asking ass

and if you could read, you'd notice that I posted my statement that you were confusing it for another kit BEFORE you posted that you were in fact mistaken, so i wouldn't have said you were full of since you were man enough to admit you had them mixed up. so don't get your panties all in a wad because you made a mistake and i hadn't noticed it yet.

and when you start calling other people names like "ass" and "smart ass" that's called getting defensive.

Originally posted by super_si_45
damn u guys just dont quit do u, when i get off, i will go to my brothers shop and find the issue i read the numbers in, then, i will pick up the jackson racing box with the sc in it and copy the part number, hell, i will take pictures and post it since he "doesnt have one", i guess i need to just shut up and not post anymore of my "experiences" since everyone just wants to contradict them, and call them foul, from now on, i know nothing, and i guess i wont post my opinion, or facts that iv read anymore

and if this post isn't "defensive" i don't know what is. don't go and ruin a good informative thread with this crap, please.

[super_si_45]

stop crying












ok people back to the normal thread minus stupid comments from morons, the bullcrap is over g let it go

[Tenacious G]

"try to talk TO people rather than DOWN TO people, it will certainly get you further in life"

way to back up your own words there. i also was trying to point out that had i known you admitted you had the SC kits mixed up, i wouldn't have called you full of it. i was commending you for being man enough to admit to that. but you want to revert back to name-calling, so that's cool. i'll let it go. :rolleyes:

back to the topic at hand ...

Little O: were the Street and Race versions dyno'd w/ stock I/H/E or did you have some aftermarket bolt ons?

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Tenacious G


back to the topic at hand ...

Little O: were the Street and Race versions dyno'd w/ stock I/H/E or did you have some aftermarket bolt ons?

I posted it here:
http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212558#post212558
or so you don't have to click the link
Street kit (not sure if i/h/e is on this, but I assume it is)

http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/03%20Civic%20SI%20Street%20SC%20.gif

Race kit
http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/03%20Civic%20SI%20Race%20SC.gif

[Tenacious G]

thanks for the link 02SilverSiHB. my question is IF the 178.6 whp/149.3tq are the numbers of the JRSC with I/H/E, like super_si_45 said, that's only about a 30 whp increase (if other members are dyno-ing at about 150 whp w/ I/H/E) . that makes the kit a tougher sell for me.

BUT, the the 178/149 are on stock I/H/E, and there is the possibility of adding another 15 whp or more w/ bolt ons, then the JRSC looks more and more like the right applicaiton for me.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
thanks for the link 02SilverSiHB. my question is IF the 178.6 whp/149.3tq are the numbers of the JRSC with I/H/E, like super_si_45 said, that's only about a 30 whp increase (if other members are dyno-ing at about 150 whp w/ I/H/E) . that makes the kit a tougher sell for me.

actually that's a 53whp increase. not all cars are the same and the result was good imo. It gained a little over 50whp compared to their stock dyno. I've seen si's dyno low like that before. Could have been bad gas, low miles, etc.



BUT, the the 178/149 are on stock I/H/E, and there is the possibility of adding another 15 whp or more w/ bolt ons, then the JRSC looks more and more like the right applicaiton for me.

I'm almost positive that the mossmotorsport ad I received about a month ago said that was i/h/e on both, but don't count on that, I could be off.

[Tenacious G]

i see your point. i forgot they only dyno'd the stock Si at 125 whp ... which is on the low end. I asked Little O why he thought the car dyno'd at such low numbers, but he wasn't sure why. interesting.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
i see your point. i forgot they only dyno'd the stock Si at 125 whp ... which is on the low end. I asked Little O why he thought the car dyno'd at such low numbers, but he wasn't sure why. interesting.
yeah, I'd be pissed if my car only dynod at that amount when I'm putting down 150whp.

[02SilverSiHB]

Okay, I thought the kit wasn't out for either the si or the type s
http://www.mossperformance.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=37908

street kit
http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/RSX%20%27S%27%20Street%20SC.gif

http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/RSX_S_Race_SC.gif

[02SilverSiHB]

Okay, I thought the kit wasn't out for either the si or the type s
http://www.mossperformance.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=37908

street kit
http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/RSX%20%27S%27%20Street%20SC.gif

Race kit
http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/details/detailjr/images/RSX_S_Race_SC.gif

[02SilverSiHB]

also notice how the dyno numbers for the type s are low also. usually type s gets about 170 something whp.

[bobdobbs]

FWIW: I called Jackson Racing yesterday and asked them when the SC for the EP3 will be out. Jim (I think) said it's delayed in production until mid-September, which sounds to me like, "We have no idea when it will be out..."

[Tenacious G]

ah, i missed it in JR Power's second post that the street version is dyno'd only with the supercharger. so, you were right ... 53 whp increase.

[JRPower]

I was not there at the time of each dyno. So, I will try and look into that.

The K-Series motor has had many ranges of baselines. In the issue of Honda Tuning, this K-Series Dyno Dilemma was explained.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by JRPower
I was not there at the time of each dyno. So, I will try and look into that.

The K-Series motor has had many ranges of baselines. In the issue of Honda Tuning, this K-Series Dyno Dilemma was explained.
yeah, I've even seen them show a stock dyno of 149! that's insane. Like I said, it all depends on the car, dyno, climate, etc.

[super_si_45]

man, who knows when it will be out? i called greddy for almost 10 months, and over that time, lets see, first, it was end of december, called them, then it was end of february, called them, then it was spring, called them, then it was mid june, etc., etc., until finally they unleashed it

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by super_si_45
man, who knows when it will be out? i called greddy for almost 10 months, and over that time, lets see, first, it was end of december, called them, then it was end of february, called them, then it was spring, called them, then it was mid june, etc., etc., until finally they unleashed it
yeah, so true, jrsc seems like it will be another few months till they are finished.

[Karel]

Uhhh.. wasn't too long ago that people were seriously complaining that the JR Supercharger thing was proving to be JUNK.
Sold as a JR product, actually by Moss and supported by apparently no one when it's innards failed all too often.
Some even went so far as to claim that their performance improved when they finally reverted to Stock in pure frustration with the crappy 'supercharger'
Is this not the very SAME 'Made in Taiwan' unit as has been sold to the unsuspecting/naive as before??

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Karel
Uhhh.. wasn't too long ago that people were seriously complaining that the JR Supercharger thing was proving to be JUNK.
Sold as a JR product, actually by Moss and supported by apparently no one when it's innards failed all too often.
Some even went so far as to claim that their performance improved when they finally reverted to Stock in pure frustration with the crappy 'supercharger'
Is this not the very SAME 'Made in Taiwan' unit as has been sold to the unsuspecting/naive as before??
I take it you are talking about that article on hybrid. There are some case by case subjects that will tell you that, and I can understand after their experiences. I think with the past units, they needed more tuning than jr or moss would openly admit. So people added a few small things and thought they were good to go. I even had the experience of the leaking bean oil...thus got rid of the car...not only for that, but because of the constant tip in detonation, the already blown up motor from before, the struggle of tuning it, and the absence of availablity of an intercooler.




Damn, I just made my self realize, how I will never go back to jrsc!

[chet]

Why is this the first I've heard of these problems? And hasn't R & D and production went completely U.S. at Jackson Racing?

[QuicksilverSIR]

Whoa - talk about a cold shower for this post, and no reply by JRPower for a week? What gives?

[VBSI]

I think it's cool that Little O is in here keeping us posted. If the SC is between $2000-$2500 I may not go the turbo route, so I will wait and see what we get.

[QuicksilverSIR]

I'm still interested too - but would like to hear a bit more from Little O on what sounds like some Big I(ssues) with their product (which, come to think of, I have heard about before from a post somewhere else from a Miata owner about a year or two ago). Overall, the JRSC still sounds like a very interesting option, but would like to hear a response on these points, and get some reassurance that whatever problems there were aren't there anymore.

[Quicksilver]

I called Jackson Racing today and their sales rep told me that there have been more delays on our kit. Early October is their estimate at this point. Oy! :(

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Quicksilver
I called Jackson Racing today and their sales rep told me that there have been more delays on our kit. Early October is their estimate at this point. Oy! :(
LOL! holy shit, I bet it has to do with the fact they are working with hondata. It could be something as simple as them getting that option setup for buyers.

[I SELL HONDAS]

I know they want to get it right but thay have changed the release date more times than ANYONE can count.
Not very professional in my opinion.
Very dissaponiting to say the least.:'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(

[NamingException]

More professional than releasing a product that wasn't ready.

It is disappointing though, you're right.

I wouldn't be surprised if it was indeed working out something with Hondata that is holding it back. The logistics are pretty confusing.

[VBSI]

Release dates change for everything from CD's, video games and Superchargers. They should stick a TBA on it to keep you vampires quiet. It is far better to correct any shortcomings or errors with a delay than it is to produce a premature Si SC product that gets hammered on for problems. We see RevHard second hand turbo installs burning up cars that should hold no relevance to smart people(read again:second hand installs), and that ruins the name. Give me a Cybernation, Greddy, HKS-who cares what brand turbo-and I'll burn my car up trying to install it because I am a mechanical idiot. The point is-give this company some f-ing time to get the product to market before doubting the performance or credibility of something we know nothing about. If you want it done faster or better, open your own wallet and R&D team and prove us all wrong.

[EP33]

Every EP owner with an aftermarket intake I'm sure ( I think) has heard their car do the "front fire". That coughing sound the engine makes through the intake when changing gears. Usually when the car is not warm and you get into the gas just a little, almost like it's too rich.

My car does it to this day, however, I wonder what happens when your engine "front fires" with a supercharger in it's path?
That can't be ccol:eek:

Any other speculations? Should this be moved to rumors and gossip:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by EP33
Every EP owner with an aftermarket intake I'm sure ( I think) has heard their car do the "front fire". That coughing sound the engine makes through the intake when changing gears. Usually when the car is not warm and you get into the gas just a little, almost like it's too rich.

My car does it to this day, however, I wonder what happens when your engine "front fires" with a supercharger in it's path?
That can't be ccol:eek:

Any other speculations? Should this be moved to rumors and gossip:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
not sure what kind of intake you have, but mine doesn't do that. As far as this going to the gossip forum, I'll keep it here, since JR Junior himself started the thread. I'm hoping he will keep us posted.

[Hondata]

Although tuning has not been finalised for the Civic Si we can give existing Hondata users an indication of the price of the upgrade from the street kit to the race kit.

For the RSX-S the upgrade consists of:

- Four 440 cc injectors and adapter clips
- Map sensor relocator
- ECU Reflash

Price will be $795

To support the increased power and revs under boost, bigger injectors are needed.
If you run the NA Hondata program with the JRSC Civic Si you run a very large risk of leaning out and blowing your engine

On the RSX-S the race program passed a smog test giving results identical to stock.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Hondata
Although tuning has not been finalised for the Civic Si we can give existing Hondata users an indication of the price of the upgrade from the street kit to the race kit.

For the RSX-S the upgrade consists of:

- Four 440 cc injectors and adapter clips
- Map sensor relocator
- ECU Reflash

Price will be $795

To support the increased power and revs under boost, bigger injectors are needed.
If you run the NA Hondata program with the JRSC Civic Si you run a very large risk of leaning out and blowing your engine

On the RSX-S the race program passed a smog test giving results identical to stock.
sweet! thanks hondata! I assume the map sensor is relocated to the manifold? That's how I remember you guys doing it to the b and d series with the jrsc. The price is actually pretty good considering a ecu tune with what I assume the modification for the map sensor (which isn't much?) and the bigger injectors...I take it the injectors are either DSM or RC engineering injectors?

[eurosteez]

Hey EP33, I can hear that sound too. I took the snorkel off my stock intake and put K&N filter, other than that, the motor is stock. Someone told me that coughing sound is just backfire coming out the intake manifold. For me its only when I'm downshifting or shifting in low rpms slowly.

[eurosteez]

anyways, Front fires as you called them only happen in NA motors. In a FI motor the backfires happen only at the exhaust.

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by Hondata
Although tuning has not been finalised for the Civic Si we can give existing Hondata users an indication of the price of the upgrade from the street kit to the race kit.

For the RSX-S the upgrade consists of:

- Four 440 cc injectors and adapter clips
- Map sensor relocator
- ECU Reflash

Price will be $795

To support the increased power and revs under boost, bigger injectors are needed.
If you run the NA Hondata program with the JRSC Civic Si you run a very large risk of leaning out and blowing your engine

On the RSX-S the race program passed a smog test giving results identical to stock.

This is very good to hear. Earlier indications for the RSX-S were that it would be around $1000, which seemed ludacris given the parts involved ($600 for ECU reflash and $200 or less for injectors). At least $795 seems more in line with what should be expected.

For the N/A Hondata owners who want to go straight to the JRSC Race setup, what's the pricing going to be like for them?

Thanks for the update!

[Quicksilver]

Fresh from JR's website:

Jackson Racing Press Releases (http://www.jacksonracing.com/pages/presspass.html)

"02-03 Civic SI Supercharger
Shipping In November!!

GOLETA, CA - Jackson Racing, having successfully tuned their Supercharged RSX-S, eagerly anticipated the delivery of the 02 Civic SI. Honda

[EP33]

Cool

That unit looks very clean. Nice and self-contained.

[Tenacious G]

i'm wondering if both SC setups will dyno higher since their baseline engines were so low.

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
i'm wondering if both SC setups will dyno higher since their baseline engines were so low.
I'm pretty sure it will dyno higher since they have such a low baseline.

[eurosteez]

The street kit had 42% hp gain. 42% gain to the average 140 hp baseline would be about 200 hp :o

[eurosteez]

race kit=64% gain to 140 base hp is close to 230 super charged horsies.:D

[K20NutBucket]

ok, so with the street application everything is included for the install, right? With the powercard theres no need to get bigger injectors, we can run it with the factory ones. correct? Also is it recommend that we use the Hondata reflash specific for the supercharger to optimize best results?? Can we run the supercharger with the stock ecu and still be safe since running low boost??

[Tenacious G]

if i'm not mistaken, JRPower posted back on the first page that the street SC setup was ONLY the JRSC, the rest was stock.

[Quicksilver]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
if i'm not mistaken, JRPower posted back on the first page that the street SC setup was ONLY the JRSC, the rest was stock.

Here's the thing that I find odd about their dyno numbers. If the street version was stock with the exception of the supercharger, and the race version was with intake, race header and exhaust, then the race version only appears to be adding higher rpms (and more power up there). Here's a rpm to rpm comparision with horsepower and torque figures showing the differences between the two kits at the same rpms. The first columns are the street version, the second is the race version, and the last columns are the hp/tq benefits the race version has over the street version.

Street Race Difference
RPM TQ HP TQ HP TQ HP
2000 128 49 130 50 2 1
2500 137 65 145 69 8 4
3000 145 83 146 83 1 1
3500 147 98 148 99 1 1
4000 148 113 148 113 0 0
4500 147 126 150 129 3 3
5000 145 138 151 144 6 6
5500 144 151 152 159 8 8
6000 142 162 148 169 6 7
6500 137 170 149 184 12 15
7000 130 173 143 191 13 17
7500 137 196

(Please forgive the terrible column line ups. It looked good until I submitted it.)

If the race version did indeed have I/H/E and the street version didn't, that's not much, if any gain from the Hondata tuning. I/H/E on the street version should be able to match the performance, except the new rpm limit. The other unusual thing about the dyno graphs is how did the street version get up to 7250 rpms? Where's the standard fuel cutoff like the line below it.

Bottom line: I suspect both were early prototypes in various stages of builds and tunings. Until we can get the production pieces in our hot little hands and dyno them, we won't really know what the kits are (and aren't) capable of. Personally I'm thinking the street version will hit 200whp with I/H/E and the race version will give another 25whp given it's added rpm capability and tuning.

[EP33]

Anybody check out how this "SuperCard (http://www.jacksonracing.com/media/manuals/pdf/995-100.pdf)" (go to page 10) plugs in.

The diag. feature seems simple. If it works similar on our cars seems good.

BTW our engines with this SC would make the engine sound crazy added to the stock engine whine.

[MetRx]

Glad to see we finally have an update on the SC. Im still eager to slap one on my car. Now, when do we get some prices?

Matt.

[abstrack]

Originally posted by 02SilverSiHB


Super_si_45 says he's seen one already..how!?
Here's his posts:
http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212075#post212075

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=212144#post212144

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?s=&postid=213035#post213035



that's a good description. Exactly how it sounds.

can i get a sound clip of this pls?

[Legrrr]

I am a little curious, with all the time JR has taken to tweak and perfect this system, are we are going to see the same numbers as were given on the preliminary dyno. Second thing that comes to mind is that with the race system, larger injectors are used to deliver more fuel, but wouldnt it also be nesesary to increase the pressure from the fuel pump.

[1abSi]

any new info yet??? i am wanting this thing bad before i go trade my car in for an R or something:confused:

[1abSi]

also just did a little looking around.....WHAT is up with the type-s race version being 1300 more for ecu flash and injectors???that is insane.....and i don't think i am alone in saying that considering other replies in this post...i mean 4295 for the race version while the street is 2999...hell i will stick with the street and see what happens....

[MetRx]

Where did you find prices on the JR kit? Those prices seem high to me. I dont think anybody in their right mind is gonna pay that much for an SC. Especially not with all the companies out now doing turbo kits for our car. If im gonna spend that much on that SC, i may as well throw in a few more bills and get a turbo kit. I agree, that race upgrade is waaay overpriced. Maybe i'll just wait for the all motor goodies to come out.

Matt

[1abSi]

Originally posted by MetRx
Where did you find prices on the JR kit? Those prices seem high to me.

Matt link 1 (http://www.mossperformance.com/Shop/ViewProducts.aspx?PlateIndexID=38316)
link 2 (http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?makeId=1000100&productId=6598&catalogId=10101&Ntx=mode+matchallany&langId=-1&storeId=10101)
not sure which version this is (http://www.modacar.com/products/Acura/RSX/MODAFOIN/)
just follow these dsit. if you want more...some might be lower?? (http://jacksonracing.com/pages/dealers.html)

[2k2ep]

I have a couple of questions, if an air to air intercooler was used along with your kits would it cause problems? If not what are the possible pro's and con's to this, and would it be worthwile? I'm thinking that some of the (lost) hp in your kits compared to turbo kits is a benefit of the intercooler.

Thanks in advance

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
I have a couple of questions, if an air to air intercooler was used along with your kits would it cause problems? If not what are the possible pro's and con's to this, and would it be worthwile? I'm thinking that some of the (lost) hp in your kits compared to turbo kits is a benefit of the intercooler.

Thanks in advance
it would have to be a total custom job...there's no ic for these JRSCs

[02HatchSI]

Does anyone know if the race jrsc will pass emissions in Missouri??? I have no idea about the carb thing... So please lmk... Plus people are saying the street kit is popping out 200 whp with i/h/e??? is this true???? when is the release date and what is the estimated prices???

[2k2ep]

I relize that jr does not make the ic themselves. I just want to know if a ic is worth it on the jrsc. Mercedes uses ic on sc motors I just figured I'd ask. Plus everyone seems to be freaked out about the power difference between jrsc and turbo at the same boost I think it mostly has to do with the ic.

[andy]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
I relize that jr does not make the ic themselves. I just want to know if a ic is worth it on the jrsc. Mercedes uses ic on sc motors I just figured I'd ask. Plus everyone seems to be freaked out about the power difference between jrsc and turbo at the same boost I think it mostly has to do with the ic.

An IC may or may not help - we'd have to wait for JSRC to answer that
one, I think. If you were going to run higher boost levels, an IC
could provide a big benefit, but you would also have to fabricate
the piping to make it work and fit. May be easier said than done.
A good example of an intercooler making a difference is the GReddy
kit. Someone on here has dynos before/after the IC and you can see
for yourself how it helped.

As for the power difference - superchargers are "robbing" power adders.
They take power *away* from the engine (in the form of parasitic
drag - there is another term for that, can't think of it - on the
pulleys), only to readd it later. So you're probably knocking power
of the engine down to 130hp or so, just to bump it back up to 180ish
with the boost.

A turbo does not "rob" the engine of any power - it is "free" power,
generated by the already existing exhaust gases. It only adds power
to the engine, which is why you get the insane power curves that a
turbo provides. There are other issues, though, such as needing a
new manifold, not getting instant boost, etc.

Not having an intercooler is NOT what causes the S/C and turbo kits
to have varying results.

[sniperSI]

The reason you don't see many type of SC w/ IC is because when you compress air, it makes it hotter, when you cool air it makes it less dense, hence cool air on an SC would mean you would have to push more boost to maintain the same PSI since you can't really up the boost on a SC the way you would a turbo, its hard to find the balance between an Sc w/ an IC.


Unless i'm wrong, anyone else want to ring in?

[Lucid Moments]

Originally posted by sniperSI
The reason you don't see many type of SC w/ IC is because when you compress air, it makes it hotter, when you cool air it makes it less dense, hence cool air on an SC would mean you would have to push more boost to maintain the same PSI since you can't really up the boost on a SC the way you would a turbo, its hard to find the balance between an Sc w/ an IC.


Unless i'm wrong, anyone else want to ring in?

When you cool air it actually makes it more dense. A denser air charge means more oxygen at the same pressure, but the sc would have to spin faster to get the same pressure to the engine.

Does that make sense?:confused:

[NamingException]

A turbo does not "rob" the engine of any power - it is "free" power

This always kills me. If you can make free energy, you're going to be a very rich man.

[TheMutt]

This always kills me. If you can make free energy, you're going to be a very rich man.

Don't be smart, you know what he meant even though he didnt.

[andy]

Originally posted by NamingException
This always kills me. If you can make free energy, you're going to be a very rich man.

Hence the quotes. Like TheMutt said, you know what I meant. ;)
Buuut, if you take it word for word, I have some prime property
in Southern Florida I'd like to sell ya! heh

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by 02HatchSI
Does anyone know if the race jrsc will pass emissions in Missouri??? I have no idea about the carb thing... So please lmk... Plus people are saying the street kit is popping out 200 whp with i/h/e??? is this true???? when is the release date and what is the estimated prices???
you wouldn't have to worry about it...unless missouri has some type of annual tech they do on your car that you have to do. carb stands for California Air Resources Board
In other words..that's for Cali folks..if it passes that it will pass any damn air law in the country

[2k2ep]

I think most of you are pretty confused when it comes to this especially ANDY. I'm just emailing them direct I did not need any bs replys and so far thats what I have. Thanks to everyone who's not F!@#ing retarded for replys before and after this post.

[Lucid Moments]

Originally posted by myeverlovinsir
The charger would not need to spin faster to get the same pressure to the engine if the air were cooler going in.

You will have the same amount (volume) of air/fuel going into each cylinder at any given speed that the charger spins at. The charger volume (output) does not fluctuate with temperature and so the pressure remains constant. The charger speed determins pressure (psi) not volume. The gain in having cooler air is that now you will have a higher amount of oxygen/fuel in the same volume of air going through the charger and more power as a result. Cooler air occupies less space so you get more fuel/oxygen in the same space (cyliner) while the pressure is still the same. The volume does not change. It still only fills the same cyliner. The amount of fuel/oxygen per volume (cyliner) can only change when the pressure is increased or the temperature is reduced. hth;)

Ask yourself this: Is it easier to compress cooler air or warmer air?
And does air temperature affect load (stress) to the charger?:D

I wasn't talking about the temperature of the air going into the compressor. Let me see if I can explain what I meant more clearly.

Air is compressed to a certain pressure.
This compressed air is then cooled, causing it to become more dense, thus taking up less space.
Less space being taken up means lower pressure.
So if you have a supercharger giving you say 7 psi without an intercooler, then you add an intercooler to it. It will give you the same 7psi before the intercooler, but after the intercooler the pressure should be lower.
So in order to get the same 7psi past the intercooler you will have to have more than 7psi before the intercooler.

[Lucid Moments]

Originally posted by 02SilverSiHB
you wouldn't have to worry about it...unless missouri has some type of annual tech they do on your car that you have to do. carb stands for California Air Resources Board
In other words..that's for Cali folks..if it passes that it will pass any damn air law in the country

Cali has the strictest pollution laws in this country. If it passes in California it will pass anywhere

[myeverlovinsir]

Originally posted by mlkelley68
I wasn't talking about the temperature of the air going into the compressor. Let me see if I can explain what I meant more clearly.

Air is compressed to a certain pressure.
This compressed air is then cooled, causing it to become more dense, thus taking up less space.
Less space being taken up means lower pressure.
So if you have a supercharger giving you say 7 psi without an intercooler, then you add an intercooler to it. It will give you the same 7psi before the intercooler, but after the intercooler the pressure should be lower.
So in order to get the same 7psi past the intercooler you will have to have more than 7psi before the intercooler.

Yes, more pressure before cooling is required to keep the pressure elevated (or maintained) after the intercooler. agreed:cool:

[NamingException]

I wasn't trying to be smart. Lots of people really think that power from a turbo is free. It's not. Even if you're not one of those people, you shouldn't say that it's free power.

Whatever.

[andy]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
I think most of you are pretty confused when it comes to this especially ANDY. I'm just emailing them direct I did not need any bs replys and so far thats what I have. Thanks to everyone who's not F!@#ing retarded for replys before and after this post.

Ouch. Easy killer, if you'd like to tell me why I'm so "confused,"
I'd love to hear it.


Originally posted by NamingException

I wasn't trying to be smart. Lots of people really think that power from a turbo is free. It's not. Even if you're not one of those people, you shouldn't say that it's free power.

Whatever.


That's why I tried to use quotes around the word "free". /shrug

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
I think most of you are pretty confused when it comes to this especially ANDY. I'm just emailing them direct I did not need any bs replys and so far thats what I have. Thanks to everyone who's not F!@#ing retarded for replys before and after this post.

whoa, slow your jets there buddy. how did you percieve the responses from andy and others as "bs" and "F!@#ing retarded"? i read them and they are all logical, well thought out and civil. how do you get the feeling they're condescending in any way?

[oldschoolimport]

the only kind of IC that is easily compatible with the jrsc is an aquamist system. it sprays a little bit of water into the intake tract and decreases the chance of detonation through in cylinder cooling. they are a few hundred $s I think. just dont let the holding tank go dry:D

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
I relize that jr does not make the ic themselves. I just want to know if a ic is worth it on the jrsc. Mercedes uses ic on sc motors I just figured I'd ask. Plus everyone seems to be freaked out about the power difference between jrsc and turbo at the same boost I think it mostly has to do with the ic.
yeah, it helps a lot and a few...and only a few dared to try it on www.clubsi.com I'll see if I can find a link of those that had jrsc and an ic

[02SilverSiHB]

okay, here we go...
this post on clubsi: http://forums.clubsi.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB12&Number=2991843&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1


Goes into detail about ic and jrsc...I check this site http://www.lhtperformance.net/sc.interc.html and they seem to make them for the b series ones. They say they cut into the jrsc manifold. I hope that if someone wants an ic with the jrsc on our cars that one of these companies help out the k series owners. It gained 25whp I believe.

this post on clubsi shows a crazy design of an ic on the jrsc...pretty cool pics:
http://forums.clubsi.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=UBB12&Number=2694772&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

[bobdobbs]

Originally posted by myeverlovinsir
Yes, more pressure before cooling is required to keep the pressure elevated (or maintained) after the intercooler. agreed:cool:
You guys are sorta missing the point. The pressure isn't what matters. The goal is to increase the number of oxygen molecules entering your engine. You can do this by compressing the air or by lowering it's temperature, or both. Compressing air raises the temperature of the air (by the ideal gas law, PV=nRT) and an intercooler helps lower the temperature, which lowers the volume, and and thus increases density, or molecules of oxygen per unit volume. The more oxygen molecules you have, the more gasoline you can burn, the more power you can generate.

[myeverlovinsir]

Originally posted by bobdobbs
You guys are sorta missing the point. The pressure isn't what matters. The goal is to increase the number of oxygen molecules entering your engine. You can do this by compressing the air or by lowering it's temperature, or both. Compressing air raises the temperature of the air (by the ideal gas law, PV=nRT) and an intercooler helps lower the temperature, which lowers the volume, and and thus increases density, or molecules of oxygen per unit volume. The more oxygen molecules you have, the more gasoline you can burn, the more power you can generate.

I went into all that crap, then deleted it... contemplated the silent freeway... then waited for you to respond. cheers:D

[eurosteez]

Originally posted by bobdobbs
The goal is to increase the number of oxygen molecules entering your engine.

thank you I was waiting for someone to bring that up. Thats the ONLY reason pressure is even a factor.
And if I'm not mistaken I don't think the JRSC even compresses the air like a true compressor. prolly wrong though.

[2k2ep]

Sorry for blowing up I wanted an answer from JR but instead I got a bunch of answers about things that I would have had to consider before asking the question in the first place Basiclly there sould be a pumping loss because of the extra restriction caused by the ic but I want to know before spending hundreds of dollars on an ic and plumbing it if there might be a significant gain to be had because of the cooler air my best guess is since you cant compensate with more boost like with a turbo you stand to gain only a percentage of that when compared to a turbo running the same boost

flame away

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by 2k2ep
Sorry for blowing up I wanted an answer from JR but instead I got a bunch of answers about things that I would have had to consider before asking the question in the first place Basiclly there sould be a pumping loss because of the extra restriction caused by the ic but I want to know before spending hundreds of dollars on an ic and plumbing it if there might be a significant gain to be had because of the cooler air my best guess is since you cant compensate with more boost like with a turbo you stand to gain only a percentage of that when compared to a turbo running the same boost

flame away
I know a few who had b series engines used the ic and kept it at stock boost. they said they lost a little boost because of the restriction from the ic, but the gain overall was better than before. That's why only a 25whp gain is seen with the ic...not too bad, but not that great I guess...depending on the price

[yellerep3]

is this thing ever coming out, i think when it comes down to it its not worth the dough, im sure if it made 100hp everyone would opt for it, but i doesnt and wont so turbos the way to go

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by yellerep3
is this thing ever coming out, i think when it comes down to it its not worth the dough, im sure if it made 100hp everyone would opt for it, but i doesnt and wont so turbos the way to go
it says on jackson racing's site that it's out, but no dealers are listing it.

[yellerep3]

Originally posted by 02SilverSiHB
it says on jackson racing's site that it's out, but no dealers are listing it.


o ok, any werd if this thing is gonna be worth it

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by yellerep3
o ok, any werd if this thing is gonna be worth it
are you asking if the jrsc is worth buying?

If so, it depends on what you want. If you want crazy horespower off the start like 250whp and above, I don't think you'll get it. We're looking at like 210whp with the hondata flash, bigger injectors.

[Tenacious G]

Originally posted by yellerep3
o ok, any werd if this thing is gonna be worth it

that's going to depend on what you're looking for. obviously it's not as powerful as a turbo, but for others it's enough hp to satisfy their near-instant boost needs (like myself).

[02SilverSiHB]

Originally posted by Tenacious G
that's going to depend on what you're looking for. obviously it's not as powerful as a turbo, but for others it's enough hp to satisfy their near-instant boost needs (like myself).
yeah, I hear ya...if I do get it, I'm getting the hondata upgrade for it.

[bobdobbs]

I doubt if the boost personalities of the JRSC and a turbo would be the deciding factor. I'd bet most turbos for our cars produce just as much power down low as the JRSC. The deciding factors will probably be cost, ease of install, and engine longevity. An average DIYer, like me, could probably install a JRSC in a weekend. A turbo would be a little more difficult, enough so that I'd feel uncomfortable doing it myself. Even if you don't do the JRSC yourself, the out the door price for a decent turbo is going to be more than the JRSC.

Sure, a turbo is going to give you more power, but some people aren't looking for ultimate power. A nice 25% boost would be enough for some.

[yellerep3]

have you guys seen the k20 gone wild clip its crazy, i think when these things start rolling around its gonna be curtins for us, i think we're gonna need something to give us some hp, think a k20a3 with even just a suspercharger in an eg

[greenguy]

Originally posted by bobdobbs

Sure, a turbo is going to give you more power, but some people aren't looking for ultimate power. A nice 25% boost would be enough for some.
I agree, I am not into peg-leg burnouts at stoplights. I just want that kick while exiting a corner. I tool around town and dont need 300h.p going to the front wheels to do it.:)

[yellerep3]

Originally posted by greenguy
I agree, I am not into peg-leg burnouts at stoplights. I just want that kick while exiting a corner. I tool around town and dont need 300h.p going to the front wheels to do it.:)


yeah i do tho:D

[DarkHatch]

Originally posted by 02SilverSiHB
damn, I kinda want to go with this, it's easier to install and safer as long as I stay at the stock boost. I'd be in the 14's for sure, all I'd need.

Yeah you say that now.:D
I'd like to get the kit, but I want 250 whp. I wanna be in the low 13's at least.

[1 fstr si]

okay, i have a few questions for you guys. if i like what i hear, this will be my very first dealings with jackdon racing. first off, my main concern. what kind of reliability can i expect outg of this kit. right now i only have I/E, and my Si is my daily driver, so, as you know, it would be tragic if something serious were to happen. and second, i know there is no intercooler system available for the kit, but, upon browsing the jackson racing accessories site last night, i noticed a liquid intercooler system (p/n 989-950) and it says 88+ all models except prelude. so, i guess my question here would be, is it compatible and would it benefit and work? but i seriously stress the first question since i do still have 15K left on my factory warranty. thanks for your time and response.

[DarkHatch]

I've been told on numerous acounts that if you put sc on it would be just as reliable as it is now. I would call JR about the cooler.

[Quicksilver]

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