Changing out of ep3

[StrangeShadow]

I am strongly considering getting rid of my ep3...basically have someone take over the payments...and replacing it with a 91-95 MR2 Turbo...it has 200-hp, 2.0-liter I-4, 5-speed manual w/OD...RWD...I would really appreciate any and everyones thoughts and coments and any more enfo or personal experience you may have with the MR2...thanks guys/gals.

pics
http://home.europa.com/~trevor/photos/mr2.jpg

http://www.users.totalise.co.uk/~mcanny/robfer.jpg

http://www.blitz-uk.co.uk/mr2-z1.jpg

http://www.mr2-toyota.com/res/layout/my95turbo_enginebay.jpg

[Surprise]

Good luck finding one in decent shape. But yes they are very nice cars, as long as you know the drawbacks (no warranty, back seat, hatch utility and premium fuel).

[StrangeShadow]

Why do you want to get rid of it?
Finacial ep3=400. payments not including insurance vs. just buy an mr2 and have no payments=put all money into after market products. [my mom gets on me a lot about the car cause my parents are paying for it right now cause this semester I'm going to college without a job...this will illiminate that prb] plus, I am a little disappointd in the ep3's performance, I expected much more.
I will be able to drift in a mr2...most of what I do in my ep3 are minor controlled slides. no car payments =D...I'll think of more later

[StrangeShadow]

hatch utility and premium fuel
by saying hatch utility what do you mean? engine location?
thanks for the enfo about the fuel.

[StrangeShadow]

What did you expect?
more power and go...basically closer to what a k2 has to offer...I didn't expect to get my rear-end handed to me by almost anything on the road...considering the 6gen si with minor bolt ons runs beter than my 7gen version...I expected better tourque and faster excel...there are times I put my foot down wanting to really move, and it proves disappointing because nothing really happens.

[Surprise]

You only have 6.5 cubes of space in the front of the car. It is shaped a bit odd dut to spare tire. There is no seats to fold down, basicly you are limited in hight and length of the objects you carry, there is also a lockable bin behind the seats. But I have a friend that has one and he goes home on the weekends and never complains about space. We (Ep3) have 15.7 cu. ft of space.

The engine is not the easiest thing to work on due to engine placement and interior is a bit small, but I am 6'4".

High output turbo cars almost always want/needs premium. Car gets about 20/27 mpg.

[StrangeShadow]

You only have 6.5 cubes of space in the front of the car. It is shaped a bit odd dut to spare tire. There is no seats to fold down, basicly you are limited in hight and length of the objects you carry, there is also a lockable bin behind the seats. But I have a friend that has one and he goes home on the weekends and never complains about space. We (Ep3) have 15.7 cu. ft of space.

The engine is not the easiest thing to work on due to engine placement and interior is a bit small, but I am 6'4".

High output turbo cars almost always want/needs premium. Car gets about 20/27 mpg.
i am 5'7" [small dude]. I have only carried about three different ppl in my ep3 since I've had it...almost a year. It's usually just me and my ep3...so space doesn't seam to be a real prb. Right now the fuel is what is catching my eye.
Do you know anything about the handling/suspension and performance?
[I've read they tend to run high 13" stock...not sure if true]

[Surprise]

As far as I can remember 0-60 about low 6 sec, 1/4 in mid 14's. Handling is a bit touchy subject, it depends on how well you drive. I remember stories of Fiero's (I know not the same car) that had really bad tendencies to swap ends if you let up in the corners, espicialy off ramps. I think in 93 and 94 Toyota made some changes to the suspension in response to these concerns, but I don't know what. Good luck if you go with the Mr.

[StrangeShadow]

As far as I can remember 0-60 about low 6 sec, 1/4 in mid 14's. Handling is a bit touchy subject, it depends on how well you drive. I remember stories of Fiero's (I know not the same car) that had really bad tendencies to swap ends if you let up in the corners, espicialy off ramps. I think in 93 and 94 Toyota made some changes to the suspension in response to these concerns, but I don't know what. Good luck if you go with the Mr.
Thank You

[Mr.02BlackSIguY]

good luck finding a mr2 turbo... they are rare as hell.

[IceD out N CALI]

be sure to think it through, u know pros and cons. one major con is that those mr2s are old and used up. pro would be that u could get out of your minivan u dont like anymore

[civic hatch boi]

Originally posted by StrangeShadow

Finacial ep3=400. payments not including insurance vs. just buy an mr2 and have no payments=put all money into after market products. [my mom gets on me a lot about the car cause my parents are paying for it right now cause this semester I'm going to college without a job...this will illiminate that prb] plus, I am a little disappointd in the ep3's performance, I expected much more.
I will be able to drift in a mr2...most of what I do in my ep3 are minor controlled slides. no car payments =D...I'll think of more later

ok initial D.

[blackyEP3]

MR2s are plenty sweet but then you'll have to worry about maintenance! Toyota are reliable cars but then when a car is 8-10 yrs old, things just start to give, no matter what.

In terms of $$, I don't know about where you are, I see MR-2s in Toronto in the local auto trader for approx $18000-20000 cdn! (rare as hell in general, nevermind a good condition one) This is for a 8-10 yr old car mind you. My EP was $21000 cdn before taxes and stuff.

So, unless you can find a real decent condition MR2, I would just keep the EP!

[Gov_E]

i would be wary about trading in a new car for one that is 10 years old. You'll end up paying more in maintenence than you would on EP car payments.

[ep pilot]

If you want the rarest of the rare, try to find yourself an '91 Celica GTS (alltrac) they have the same engine as the MR-2t albeit a little bit heaftier, it was nearly as much fun as the WRX. or 2.5RS for better.


-Ryan

[blackyEP3]

Originally posted by ep pilot
If you want the rarest of the rare, try to find yourself an '91 Celica GTS (alltrac) they have the same engine as the MR-2t albeit a little bit heaftier, it was nearly as much fun as the WRX. or 2.5RS for better.


-Ryan


Man, you hit the spot with that one..................Hmmm.....that is one of my favorite cars!!

Reminds me of Sega Rally the video game!!

[phatsi]

mr2's are fun, easy to make fast, reliable, twitchy in handling, but the only negative....they are just getting old and ratty...it really is tough to find one that is worth saving or isnt in rough shape...i think they are sweet but too many of my friends who have had them are jumping ship because they are just to old and going down hill...just a bit of what i have heard and seen....;)

[SiR Medic]

Originally posted by civic hatch boi


ok initial D.


:D Ha-ha!

[StrangeShadow]

ok initial D.
lol I didn't think anyone state side heard of it!

I just saw a supra this sunday at a scca event over here at catsle, I KNOW it isn't a supra! but it reminded me of the AE86 corolla. :)

[StrangeShadow]

mr2's are fun, easy to make fast, reliable, twitchy in handling, but the only negative....they are just getting old and ratty...it really is tough to find one that is worth saving or isnt in rough shape
Yeah, i've been looking about...and the turbos are xtremly rare. After a bit of research I've found a few places to locate engines very cheap...considering when/if I find one(car) it may be due for for one. Plus, I've seen a few w/gt-s swaps...so I'll probably look into that as well before heading this way. The second gen was still produced throughout Europe well into 99'...our production stopped in 95'...therefore parts from there and Asia are accesable...in better use and w/more power of course. I'm making sure I really look/think this trough...just really wanted ppl's thoughts.

[StrangeShadow]

be sure to think it through, u know pros and cons. one major con is that those mr2s are old and used up. pro would be that u could get out of your minivan u dont like anymore
Will do. I've seen one turbo and one non-turbo in my town...i'll probably see if I can run down the owners to get a better veiw/opinion and just a complete overview of the car. This is one thing I really want to reasearch quiet a bit before heading down that road. I really still love my ep3 a lot, infact I don't really know anyone that couldn't ;) it's a really fun car...and I'll probably do whatever I can to keep it aswell.

[lastsaga]

i've had some experience with mr2's, and drove one for awhile until i started looking for an ep3. by the way, i have more experience with the n/a than a turbo.. but i think what i have to say could still apply.

i'll just tell you what i think about the car:

the car looks really great. it's such a visual pleaser; i really think toyota was years ahead its time when they designed this car.

the finish is decent, it wasn't terrible, but just remember almost all of the mr2's out there are close to 10 years old now. expect to have a lot of rattling and cracks and broken switches and junk.

handling... bah. mid-engine really throws a curve ball at you, especially if you're going to take it auto-x or touge. take note that there was a suspension change in 93 which makes the newer models (93+) a little less likely to snap oversteer. i personally don't have experience with the 93+, so i can't tell you for sure what the differences are.

power - off the line, the mr2 is great. and it's not a disappointment. great healthy low end torque that makes those 2nd-3rd-2nd turns so much fun :)

the turbo model, as with all stock turbo cars, have problems regarding engine reliability and turbo life, but if you're going to be rebuilding it anyway.. i guess it doesn't really matter.

--drift-- ahhhgh.. this car is a terrible drifter! please please pick up a 240sx, corolla gts, or an n/a FC (turbo if you can afford it!) :X they're much easier to learn and control a drift on, and 10x easier to work on (excluding the FC).

oh yeah, mr2 has premature rear tire wear, and if you start drifting in it.. ^_________^ heh. t-tops leak (worn seals), and the trunk space is there for show :D

i sound like i'm trying to dissuade you from an mr2, but.. i still love the car. t-tops 0wn me, and there's nothing like having the sound of your intake wooshing right behind your ear :) they're definitely getting much more affordable these days, and there's plenty of aftermarket support for the sw20.

i'll write more as i think of it, but it's definitely not a "bad" buy. hope that helps a little!

[StrangeShadow]

i've had some experience with mr2's, and drove one for awhile until i started looking for an ep3. by the way, i have more experience with the n/a than a turbo.. but i think what i have to say could still apply.

i'll just tell you what i think about the car:

the car looks really great. it's such a visual pleaser; i really think toyota was years ahead its time when they designed this car.

the finish is decent, it wasn't terrible, but just remember almost all of the mr2's out there are close to 10 years old now. expect to have a lot of rattling and cracks and broken switches and junk.

handling... bah. mid-engine really throws a curve ball at you, especially if you're going to take it auto-x or touge. take note that there was a suspension change in 93 which makes the newer models (93+) a little less likely to snap oversteer. i personally don't have experience with the 93+, so i can't tell you for sure what the differences are.

power - off the line, the mr2 is great. and it's not a disappointment. great healthy low end torque that makes those 2nd-3rd-2nd turns so much fun

the turbo model, as with all stock turbo cars, have problems regarding engine reliability and turbo life, but if you're going to be rebuilding it anyway.. i guess it doesn't really matter.

--drift-- ahhhgh.. this car is a terrible drifter! please please pick up a 240sx, corolla gts, or an n/a FC (turbo if you can afford it!) :X they're much easier to learn and control a drift on, and 10x easier to work on (excluding the FC).

oh yeah, mr2 has premature rear tire wear, and if you start drifting in it.. ^_________^ heh. t-tops leak (worn seals), and the trunk space is there for show

i sound like i'm trying to dissuade you from an mr2, but.. i still love the car. t-tops 0wn me, and there's nothing like having the sound of your intake wooshing right behind your ear they're definitely getting much more affordable these days, and there's plenty of aftermarket support for the sw20.

i'll write more as i think of it, but it's definitely not a "bad" buy. hope that helps a little!


WOW Thanks alot for all the enfo! really appreciate it.

[lastsaga]

oh yeah, i just read that you aren't shying away from engine swaps.

if i remember correctly the USDM turbo outputs 200/200, and the n/a outputs 130/140. outside of califiornia i think the n/a's produce 135/140, or something like that (CA emissions laws). i might just be making that up though :P hahaha

okay, seriously: some swaps for the 3sgte engine: the latest japanese sw20 engines: outputting upwards of 240hp or more

if you want to stay n/a, there's the BEAMS vvt-i (breakthrough engine advancement management systems?? or some acronym only those crazy japanese can come up with) engine that outputs 200 of naturally aspirated power from a 2.0 liter engine. these are really rare though and probably more costly than the integra hype-r engine.

oh another note, if you're going to swap in a turbo engine, it'd be a good idea to start off with a turbo platform. there are just too many modifications you're going to have to make to fit in a 3sgte into an n/a engine bay. because it's not just a simple "drop in" process, it's just not worth the money :P

hope you make a good decision!

[StrangeShadow]

Found some interesting stuff during my searches...and great pics..."""tomorrow I'm gonna go check one out...I saw where a guy in town works, who has one.""" - this will be a chance to get a personal opinion of what they are really like in person, not just from a distance, or in pictures, or from dynos or charts.

turbo enfo

http://www.madpsi.net/MR2PEKit.htm

Some better pics

http://www.madpsi.net/HKS%20turbo%20Exhaust.jpg

http://www.madpsi.net/greddysp2.jpg

http://www.madpsi.net/0209it_mrtwo02_zoom.jpg

http://www.madpsi.net/2002-01-13%2520033.jpg

http://www.madpsi.net/2002-01-13%2520034.jpg

http://www.madpsi.net/2002-01-13%2520032.jpg

Edit: plus a crazed twin turbo
http://www.madpsi.net/PMR2.htm

-well, off for sleep for tomorrow...thanks for the help, thoughts, ideas and opinions from everyone, that is one of the best things about this site.

[StrangeShadow]

oh another note, if you're going to swap in a turbo engine, it'd be a good idea to start off with a turbo platform. there are just too many modifications you're going to have to make to fit in a 3sgte into an n/a engine bay. because it's not just a simple "drop in" process, it's just not worth the money :P
Thanks...I was just thinking about that.