Camber adjustment this Wed: Auto-x and daily driving

[chet]

Is there a good basic setting for both daily dr. and auto-x? I want a little toe out. The last time they set it, well it's almost at a positive #, not neg.

I'm like this to be the last time I pay for this setting and alignment stuff. Can you guys who use your EP as a daily dr. and who auto-x regularly give me some suggestions? Thank you gentlemen.

[andy]

chet,

I'm not autoXer (not yet, anyway), but here's what I did with my
camber (with help from a guy who races a rotary kit car pretty
seriously) - at -2.0ish, the car handled great. But after talking
with that guy, he said I'll get a lot of wear and it's really not
needed for the street. So we went with -0.5-0.6 or so and it seems
to be fine. I want to say we made the rear about the same, but actually
we may have left it closer to 0.

I kind of wonder how much of a handling difference -2 camber would
make, though. I mean, is it enough to justify a 1/2 second difference
at AutoX (this is a question, not a statement)?

[BlasTech]

I currently have -1.8f / -.8r camber, and 0 toe all around.

Thats the most negative camber I could get up front with a 2" drop and no toe in!

What suspension do you have, and which tires?

[ConeCrazy02]

-1.8 front and -0.something in rear, need adjustment and soon.

[chet]

Originally posted by BlasTech
I currently have -1.8f / -.8r camber, and 0 toe all around.

Thats the most negative camber I could get up front with a 2" drop and no toe in!

What suspension do you have, and which tires?

I have the KW V2's. . .And during auto-x I run 16" slipstreams w/Azenis. Daily driving is done on 17" Attacks w/ Toyo Proxes FZ4's

[BlasTech]

Sounds like you're serious engough about atuto-x to justify some negative camber, then.

I think with the KW's you can get a little negative camber up front, so max it out up there (probably in -1 range) and then if you have a rear camber kit, go with 0 back there.

Toe can be set to zero or just a very small amount out to enhance stability in cornering, but toe out will effect your tire wear (camber wont unless its way outta whack). Getting the negative camber up front is most important, and not any toe in!

[Burgh]

I'm running -1.5F/-1.0R for my camber settings. 0 toe all around. Somewhere between 1-2degrees of camber is probably a good compromise for both autox and street. Toe is what will kill your tires on the street more than camber anyways. I just started daily driving on Azenis with these settings so I'll let you know how my tires look in a few months. :)

[ep_nezay]

I was only able to get -1.4 up in front before I ran out of toe adjustment from the tie rods.
I wanted to go -2 and then put it back to 0 when street driven. Now, that I have -1.4 I left it at that, seems to be doing well on the tire wear.

[chet]

Thanks for all of the info guys. Burgh, definitely let us know how your Azenis wear.

I will probably have them set it somewhere between -1.0 and -1.5 in the front. And pretty close to 0 in the rear. ANd it looks like 0 toe everywhere.

[ConeCrazy02]

If you have a tire pyrometer, it can help you determine how much camber to run.

[chet]

Originally posted by ConeCrazy02
If you have a tire pyrometer, it can help you determine how much camber to run.

Haven't picked one up yet. I was planning on picking one up at some pt. during the upcoming season. As far as the camber, I just want something basic and convenient to accomodate daily &/or auto-x.

[Burgh]

Originally posted by chet
Thanks for all of the info guys. Burgh, definitely let us know how your Azenis wear.

I will probably have them set it somewhere between -1.0 and -1.5 in the front. And pretty close to 0 in the rear. ANd it looks like 0 toe everywhere.

Here's a funny thing though. When I went to get my alignment, I had specified 0 camber in the rear. But the guy said that there's no way to adjust the camber in the rear without getting an aftermarket camber kit. Aftermarket camber kit = no more running in stock class so I said screw that. My stock camber in the rear is about -1.0 so I just left it.

I'm hoping and praying that the Azenis last me a whole year of racing and daily driving. If they wear out in 6 mos or something, I'm going to have to invest in another set of wheels and falkens that will be dedicated to racing and daily drive on my stock wheels with regular street tires.

This is off topic, but our wheels weigh a TON!!!

[chet]

Originally posted by Burgh
Here's a funny thing though. When I went to get my alignment, I had specified 0 camber in the rear. But the guy said that there's no way to adjust the camber in the rear without getting an aftermarket camber kit. Aftermarket camber kit = no more running in stock class so I said screw that. My stock camber in the rear is about -1.0 so I just left it.

I'm hoping and praying that the Azenis last me a whole year of racing and daily driving. If they wear out in 6 mos or something, I'm going to have to invest in another set of wheels and falkens that will be dedicated to racing and daily drive on my stock wheels with regular street tires.

This is off topic, but our wheels weigh a TON!!!

If you can afford it, I'd buy another set anyway. THe lighter wheel will definitely help you regardless. And changing wheels won't change your stock class will it??

[Burgh]

Just a general alignment question from someone who doesn't know much about HOW alignments are done - how is it that the alignment on a stock car with stock parts can be -1.0 or more??? I just asked cuz I've seen this on many cars before. Kind of makes it seem pointless to get the camber bolts that I got to get to -1.4 or something.


Originally posted by chet
If you can afford it, I'd buy another set anyway. THe lighter wheel will definitely help you regardless. And changing wheels won't change your stock class will it??

Two reasons - I'm lazy and I'm lazy. I don't want to spend the money and then have to change tires every time I go racing. I'm such a lazy bastard, it's not even funny. :D Changing wheels for stock class is cool as long as the wheel you change to is the same diameter, width, and offset. I SO wish we had 15x6.5 or 15x7 stock wheels. 15x6 sucks!

[chet]

Originally posted by Burgh
Just a general alignment question from someone who doesn't know much about HOW alignments are done - how is it that the alignment on a stock car with stock parts can be -1.0 or more??? I just asked cuz I've seen this on many cars before. Kind of makes it seem pointless to get the camber bolts that I got to get to -1.4 or something.



Two reasons - I'm lazy and I'm lazy. I don't want to spend the money and then have to change tires every time I go racing. I'm such a lazy bastard, it's not even funny. :D Changing wheels for stock class is cool as long as the wheel you change to is the same diameter, width, and offset. I SO wish we had 15x6.5 or 15x7 stock wheels. 15x6 sucks!

To be honest, I can't really answer your question. But I think the difference is having the car lower than stock which automatically changes the camber and toe probably.

BTW, I ended up w/ -1.1 camber total, no toe. It looks good and is driving better. I put so many miles on it back and forth to work--I figured less was better.

The stock wheels suck, no matter how you look at them (except for their looks). They're damn heavy and narrow. . .I know what you mean about the lazy part. I change my wheels usually the day before I'd auto-x. I work nights and its just too damn hard to get to the event early enough to change the wheels out then.

[Burgh]

I know that lowering affects your camber (not all that much in a mcstrut suspension though). I was asking how the cars were able to gain camber in bone stock form. I've seen alignment readouts on bone stock cars which had more than -1.0 camber.

If we had a 15x6.5 wheel, I'd just get a set of slipstreams and daily drive and autox on those. But since we only have a 15x6... :mad:

[chet]

Originally posted by Burgh
I know that lowering affects your camber (not all that much in a mcstrut suspension though). I was asking how the cars were able to gain camber in bone stock form. I've seen alignment readouts on bone stock cars which had more than -1.0 camber.


You got me man, I'm clueless on the subject.

[BlasTech]

The factory optional "crash" bolts are G-stock legal, since they're in the Helms as part of alignment.

They cost $11 for two, and you can use 4 to get more camber.

http://home.austin.rr.com/dmcknight/camber1.jpg

[Burgh]

Yeah, I got the one bolt for the top but was only able to get -1.4 degrees with it. Maybe I need to go out and get another bolt for the bottom hole to get closer to -2.0.

[BlasTech]

That'll do, but if you ever drop it, you'll find you cant go far without toe in. Ive dropped 2" and I can only get -1.8 before I run out of toe threads.

Later this year I might raise it up .25" and get some more camber, but I gotta space my alignments about 6 months apart since they cost $$ where I go.

[ConeCrazy02]

Camber bolts slips really easy, when they do, your camber will be off and you'll need an alignment. SCCA doesn't allow the use of camber bolts, which I think is really unfair.