My Clutch Master Cylinder is bad. :)

[siver-SI]

Well there are not to many post on the board when a part goes out on their car they are happy, but I am. Since around 7000 miles ago I have been fighting with my old dealership to take a look at my notchy transmission and I got the story that it is normal to we took it on a test drive and did not find a problem. BTW their idea of a long test drive is a 1/2 mile.

So after calling Honda of America to see if I could get something worked out my dealership got worse in customer service when Honda contacted them. On my last visit they replaced the rear window and lied to me when the broke the first one and that was the reason it had to be at the dealership an extra 2 days. They told me that they were keeping to do test drive it and check it out. The reason I know they broke it was because I found broken glass in the back hatch of my car when I was cleaning out the next weekend. The way the test drove it and tested it out was just by driving it to the tint place to get my rear window re-tinted.

After that I had it with them and I changed dealerships from the dummies at Crystal Lake Honda to the great guys at Motor Werks. About a week after I took my car to Crystal Lake Honda I went on a long drive "witch this is what I told my old Honda dealership to do and they never did in the 6 times I brought it in for the problem" and I found out that not only was my notchyness in the car, but I also had a creak in the pedal after my car had been driven for around 20-30 minutes. This is a longer drive then I do to work so I never noticed it until I had my radio and my fan on low.

Well I dropped of my car yesterday at Motor Werks for the creaky clutch and nochieness and guess what? They took it on a long test drive and found the problem to both they think. The have found out for sure that my Clutch Master cylinder is bad and they had to next day air out the part for me so they can get it in tomorrow. After that they are going to do another long test drive before they call me to tell me that the car is ready.

The other cool thing is that even though I did not buy my car from them I got a free loaner when I dropped it off last night and they did not even know what the problem was with it yet. I had to wait 2 weeks for it though since they had then booked for that long. I am not complaining. It is a big dealership and their Honda department is allowed only 5 new loaners a day. So even though I have my loaner an extra day now it will not take it away from someone who needed it today.

All I got to say after this long write up that after around 9 months and 7000 miles my car is getting fixed:). I am just so happy that I got a good dealership now.


This is my new great dealership.

http://www.motorwerks.com/

It is around a 25min. more drive but I do not care.

[fsugatorbait]

Its good to hear about peoples positive experiences with dealerships after all the bad ones that are floating around. Glad to hear it all worked out for ya. :)

[R1/SiR]

I've been told service is the money maker in a dealership. How do these dealers survive doing this kind of shit. My car came out in worse shape after being with the dealer then before. Go figure!

[2.0L Monster]

I have 4 dealers by me and I would only trust one of them with my car. But that dealership is very good.

[STP03BlueSI]

Mine has been in 3 times to Crown, and once to Autoway about the Shifter being notchy. and still nothing.


Ill just keep bitchin.

[pappaljf]

Clutch Master replacement will fix the clutch noise, but the notchy shifting is another matter entirely....

Ask them to check and change the tranny fluid, that helps a bit. You may also ask them to check your shifter assembly, that may be the source of some of the notchiness.

[Mugen Power]

I've taken mine in for the notchy tranny a few times and everytime they either blew it off or couldn't replicate the problem. Is anything even happening with the signed petition and the trasmission thread up top? They seem to be pointless since nothing's come of it so far...

[siver-SI]

Well got my car back today and after a hour drive to college from the dealership I must say that this was a major problem in my car. My trans shifts a smooth as it did when I took it off the show room floor. They replaced the cylinder and fully flushed out all the old fluid. The labor would have been $160 for the car so I do not know if they did any other adjustments to it.

All I have to say is that I am loving my EP again. A few things that my dealership told me was normal in the feeling of my cluch has gone away and my pedel goes down so smooth. I have even noticed that my take off and shift from 1st to 2nd is a lot smoother too.

To me it seems like the Master Cylinder was not fully disengading the cluch at times and this is what was causing the problem.

I am just so happy that my EP is good to go again.

With 50's this weekend I hope to get my springs on to give my car a nice 1 1/2 inch drop.

[Mugen Power]

You know, I was thinking that might be part of the problem. I say part only because the notchiness is most apparent in certain gears (1-3 in my case). Howerver, I've noticed that my revs drop very slightly when I lift off of the clutch pedal. This is most evident when I start the car in the morning when the revs are high to begin with. What happens is, I clutch in to start the car and then clutch out and it idles in neutral. When I do that, the revs drop a bit and if I clutch in again, the revs increase. Also, when I clutch out during that time, I hear a sound that I can only assume is the clutch not fully disengaging, kind of like a metal grating sound. Anyway, that's a part of my story, hopefully I can find a dealer who will replace these things on my car. :(

[siver-SI]

Originally posted by Mugen Power
You know, I was thinking that might be part of the problem. I say part only because the notchiness is most apparent in certain gears (1-3 in my case). Howerver, I've noticed that my revs drop very slightly when I lift off of the clutch pedal. This is most evident when I start the car in the morning when the revs are high to begin with. What happens is, I clutch in to start the car and then clutch out and it idles in neutral. When I do that, the revs drop a bit and if I clutch in again, the revs increase. Also, when I clutch out during that time, I hear a sound that I can only assume is the clutch not fully disengaging, kind of like a metal grating sound. Anyway, that's a part of my story, hopefully I can find a dealer who will replace these things on my car. :(

Hey I had the some problem too witht he RPM drop. I did not notice it was gone till you said something. Just as I got out of college I started my and I noticed that I did not have the RPM drop anymore . This was something that my old dealership said was normal.

This is a list of things that are gone now on my car with the repair but my old dealship said was normal.

1) RPM drop when letting off the cluch
2) Not having a smooth feeling dressing the cluch. (said feeling a small vibration was normal because I was just feeling the cluch working)
3) 1st gear being hard to get into gear.
4) Notchie when cold. (Yea my car will not feel as smooth when cold as it does when warm, but the night and day diffrence now is just unbelivable. )

I am giving Honda of Anerica a call on Friday night just to tell then who happy I am with my new dealership and how my other dealership lied to me over and over. I had no real proof before, but now I have a lot with Motorwerks finding the problem.

[fsugatorbait]

I have this exact same problem when I let the clutch out at idle and it sounds almost like metal grinding. My roomate had the same symptom before he brought his 99ex to honda and they ended up having to replace one of his shift forks. Ill have to check out the RPM increase/decrease, but you definatley hit the nail on the head with the sound im getting.

[Mugen Power]

The RPM drop is relatively small. In my case, it's less than or equal to about 100 RPM.

[siver-SI]

Originally posted by Mugen Power
The RPM drop is relatively small. In my case, it's less than or equal to about 100 RPM.

That is about what mine was this morning. It use to be around 300+.

[Siman]

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPEND TO ME, minus the rear window incidnet....

they had my car for 2 weeks, replace the tranny 3 times cause they couldnt get it right...and meanwhile arguing with HONDA of AMERICA and two dealerships to do somethign about it, it took me 6K miles to finally get it fixed...

and there version of a test drive was the same as my dealerships too heheheh

awsome its turning out OK;)

[Mugen Power]

Wow, that's pretty high. Actually, mine is usually in the 100-200 RPM range and this shouldn't happen at all...

[myeverlovinsir]

Have any of you tried to adjust the clutch master cylinder engagement rod behind the clutch pedal? I had really bad engagement problems and grinding and almost everything you could think of on the new tranny until I made the adjustment. All of the problems went away after that small adjustment. You will need a 12mm wrench and 5 min to do it. Here is a pic from the manual.(pg 12-4) All you really do is loosen the lock nut and spin out the threaded rod to fully against the piston. (D and E in the pic) The amount of play and how far I moved the push rod out towards the piston wan no more than 2-3mm. What it did was help release the clutch more cleanly. It's a simple fix and can be the root of many a symptom as I discovered myself.

http://a3.cpimg.com/image/81/DA/30663553-3141-01800200-.jpg

[siver-SI]

Originally posted by Siman
THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT HAPPEND TO ME, minus the rear window incidnet....

they had my car for 2 weeks, replace the tranny 3 times cause they couldnt get it right...and meanwhile arguing with HONDA of AMERICA and two dealerships to do somethign about it, it took me 6K miles to finally get it fixed...

and there version of a test drive was the same as my dealerships too heheheh

awsome its turning out OK;)

So they replaced 3 transes and all that needed to be replaced was a $57 Master Cyilinder?

[Siman]

I guess?

beets the heck out of me!

THANKS ALOT MYEVERLOVINSIR:D :D :D :D

[phatfreeza]

hey myeverlovinsir... i have a creaky clutch.. would the adjustment you mentioned help? i have a cai and lowered on teins. the dealer wouldn't give me problems over the mods for a creaky clutch would they? thanks.

[Siman]

he isnt mister fix it you know hehehe

the creaky clutch is the pushrod needing to be relubed or something..:cool:

[myeverlovinsir]

Originally posted by phatfreeza
hey myeverlovinsir... i have a creaky clutch.. would the adjustment you mentioned help? i have a cai and lowered on teins. the dealer wouldn't give me problems over the mods for a creaky clutch would they? thanks.

I would just spray it down with oil(WD40) at the joint where the creaking is. The pushrod does not have any lube on it and it's just a free moving part of the pedal that engages the master cylinder piston.

[Siman]

I just did the mod myeverlovinsir!! It works beutifully now!! The clutch disengauges shorter into the pedal stroke, in turn moving the clutch discs further apart in that motion(correct?)

The clutch doesnt have the "slack" in the pedal motion at all know!!

i just drove the car around the hood and NO problems!!

the only hard part was getting the fuse box panal off...LOL:confused:

[myeverlovinsir]

That's good to hear. I suspect alot of the poor disengagement of the clutch and associated tranny problems are attributable to that little fix. One other thing you will want check is the clutch fluid level. If it's really low you may have to bleed the clutch line which is a whole other ball of wax.;)

[Siman]

that is another good tip children, from the "SWAP GOD" himself LOL

you should be a Honda Tech Rep.....

I will check the fluid tomorrow!

Thanks man! You are ONE OF, if not THE BEST attribute to this entire forum!;)

[Siman]

by the way, how is your Head swap going, i know you got the type-s head installed and the Type-s ecu, or did you just have hondata for the Si?

:rolleyes:

[Siman]

hey myeverlovinsir,

this guy on honda-tech is asking about the headswap!

give him a little 1..2... on your headswap!

http://www.honda-tech.com/zeropost?cmd=tshow&id=803315

;)

[myeverlovinsir]

There is a bunch of other stuff since the head swap last year, read my sig. Head has over 4k miles on it now and is road tuned so far and will likely not waste time dyno tuning it. Kpro is a godsend, will be on the dyno after the JRSC install.;)

[myeverlovinsir]

Originally posted by Siman
hey myeverlovinsir,

this guy on honda-tech is asking about the headswap!

give him a little 1..2... on your headswap!

http://www.honda-tech.com/zeropost?cmd=tshow&id=803315

;)

I deleted my head swap thread to get some closure, and you would not believe the influx of people that I still have asking questions about it daily. I just don't have the time in my busy schedule to address everyone. I still try my best. BTW: I don't have an account at honta-tech and I did not use the spoon gasket, I wanted lower compression for boost purposes.

[phatfreeza]

Originally posted by myeverlovinsir
I would just spray it down with oil(WD40) at the joint where the creaking is. The pushrod does not have any lube on it and it's just a free moving part of the pedal that engages the master cylinder piston.

hmm will try this out ... gotta get some WD40 now..

[Siman]

Originally posted by myeverlovinsir
I deleted my head swap thread to get some closure, and you would not believe the influx of people that I still have asking questions about it daily. I just don't have the time in my busy schedule to address everyone. I still try my best. BTW: I don't have an account at honta-tech and I did not use the spoon gasket, I wanted lower compression for boost purposes.

thanks anyways man!!!

:D

[Mugen Power]

Dang, Siman, didn't you see? They got rid of the post requirement for the raffle so you don't have to post so much! :D

J/K

Anyway, do you have a larger version of that picture or maybe a scan of it?

[myeverlovinsir]

http://we-todd-did-racing.com/wetoddimage.wtdr/i=wMzE3NTc1NnM0MTNkZmQzMXk1NDE%3D

[Mugen Power]

Nice! Thanks a lot, I'll have to look into doing that.

You know what sucks, though, is that there is probably some permanent damage done to the gears already since I'm racking up the miles. :(

Maybe some day I'll find a dealer willing to look at it...

[siver-SI]

Originally posted by myeverlovinsir
http://we-todd-did-racing.com/wetoddimage.wtdr/i=wMzE3NTc1NnM0MTNkZmQzMXk1NDE%3D

I bet when the replaced the Cylinder they did this adjustment too and that is why everything is working so great now. I did not think the cluch had an adjustment since my old dealership told me that since it was a hydrolic system no adjustments were needed.

I think my old dealership needs to be re-certified by Honda before they screw over any more people.

[Mugen Power]

I didn't think about doing any adjustments but the tech that drove my car the last time I took it in for the tranny was blabbing on about some hydraulic clutch crap so it shouldn't be rough. And that was one out of many excuses he used... :rolleyes:

[Siman]

I did the adjustment.....WORKS WONDERS if you have a keen feel for a car ( if you know what i mean )

it took me 5 minutes too....like I said, the toughest part was removing the fuse panal under the steeting column:confused:

[Siman]

Originally posted by Mugen Power
Dang, Siman, didn't you see? They got rid of the post requirement for the raffle so you don't have to post so much! :D

J/K

Anyway, do you have a larger version of that picture or maybe a scan of it?

LOL....

I love posting! I like to type...:p ok "MANG":*

[myeverlovinsir]

Originally posted by Mugen Power
Nice! Thanks a lot, I'll have to look into doing that.

You know what sucks, though, is that there is probably some permanent damage done to the gears already since I'm racking up the miles. :(

Maybe some day I'll find a dealer willing to look at it...

I you have damage to your syncros or gears this won't help. The manual says to have clearance between the pushrod and mastercylinder, however this gap is what reduces stroke on the pedal. Even slight amounts. The pushrod adjustment should be made to bring it closer to the piston but not put pressure on it. If you tend to rest your foot on the clutch, you may notice slipping from a slight depression because the piston engagement is sooner. Idealy full release of the clutch should occur near mid stroke and it will differ for others depending on clutch wear and pressure plate condition.