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View Full Version : k20a2 swap?



r_jones06
04-20-2008, 12:22 PM
I'm looking to get rid of my a3 and go with the a2... how hard of a swap is it? what all would i need to do the swap?

AUTiger
04-20-2008, 12:25 PM
where in bama are you?

From what I understand the swap is pretty much straightforward, but people that have done this swap will be able to help out a great deal, just give it some time. Most of the knowledgeable members are busy trying to restore all the info that was lost in the crash.

r_jones06
04-20-2008, 12:28 PM
Cullman/Tuscaloosa

AUTiger
04-20-2008, 12:31 PM
okay, way up there. One of the moderators is from the Muscle Shoals area I believe.

talonXracer
04-20-2008, 12:40 PM
It is very easy. Just follow the Helms manual for engine replacement.

crhatch02
04-20-2008, 12:43 PM
It is very easy. Just follow the Helms manual for engine replacement.

Helms manual is indeed a lifesaver...

b.r.i.a.n.
04-20-2008, 03:15 PM
i used this guide

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/tech/0212scc_civic_si_type_r/index.html

the swap is straightforward. same mounting points are used. any bolt ons you had before will just go on the k20a2.

ep3k20a2
04-20-2008, 03:22 PM
its a direct swap, direct bolt in, no need to change anything

talonXracer
04-20-2008, 03:28 PM
The only thing that is different from the Helms manual engine replacement procedure, is the removal of the K20A2's power steering pump and then bolting the K20A3's idler pulley in it's place.

The 6spd trans has a reverse lockout, the 5spd does not. The connector for this is on the A2's engine harness only. This is not required to have a functioning and safe vehicle. It is almost impossible to hit reverse accidentally on our shift pattern(unless you are on the pipe).

shadowmd
04-20-2008, 03:41 PM
like everyone says, its a straight forward swap. trust me dude, u will LOVE IT! i love mine!

SpAdZ
04-22-2008, 08:19 AM
x2...very str8 fwd...i ran my 5spd tranny so no worry about the reverse lockout but just plug everything abck up as it was on the a3

uneekazn1
04-22-2008, 01:25 PM
like everyone says, its a straight forward swap. trust me dude, u will LOVE IT! i love mine!

listen to this guy here :jaw:.. lol, he is the man for your questions...

yo, shadow. z3 cams is better than z1 in a k20a2 motors..?? how much power diff in between both cams.?

03K20A3Si
04-22-2008, 03:44 PM
:nod: SWAP!!! Love my A2! :mwink: Super easy...

shadowmd
04-22-2008, 04:31 PM
listen to this guy here :jaw:.. lol, he is the man for your questions...

yo, shadow. z3 cams is better than z1 in a k20a2 motors..?? how much power diff in between both cams.?

gracias lol...um well im actually thinkin about pickin up a k20z1 exhaust cam. the z3 intake cam in the most aggressive intake cam honda makes so thats stayin lol....but the z3 exhaust cam is the same as the a2. so the z1 exhaust cam should help a lil bit. with my new setup im lookin to make 228whp and 163-ish-wtq

kwiksi
04-22-2008, 05:47 PM
Easy swap. These are made with the A2 overseas for every market but ours.:mmad: Dunno why we can't get the Type R. Oh well I'll just settle for the next best.:mwink:

Princess
04-22-2008, 05:59 PM
Stock USA ep3 engine (k20a3) with a turbo will own a stock k20a2 engine.

The 2006 RSX-S engine has higher horsepower than the k20a2 engine.

WhiteOnRice
04-22-2008, 06:03 PM
Yeah, at a higher cost and harder install.

lldiesel386ll
04-22-2008, 06:52 PM
The 6spd trans has a reverse lockout, the 5spd does not. The connector for this is on the A2's engine harness only.
is there any way to connect the two without the a2's engine harness? lets assume i am on the pipe:mtongue:lol

actually more so that i can retain as much oem function as possible when i do this

sorry for the threadjack:mconfused:

r_jones06
04-22-2008, 07:02 PM
lol thanks for all the info guys... I had read somewhere else that people ran into problems using the ep3 wiring harness. Something about plugs being further distances so you have to lengthen wires. Not too big of a problem though. I think I will take you guys word for it. Looks like it's time to order the a2 :first:

one more question... the a2 motor has the standard old school VTEC on it. How does this work when I do the swap? does the solenoid have to be wired up or is everything already ready just use kpro?

v1c10us
04-22-2008, 07:19 PM
The only thing that is different from the Helms manual engine replacement procedure, is the removal of the K20A2's power steering pump and then bolting the K20A3's idler pulley in it's place.

The 6spd trans has a reverse lockout, the 5spd does not. The connector for this is on the A2's engine harness only. This is not required to have a functioning and safe vehicle. It is almost impossible to hit reverse accidentally on our shift pattern(unless you are on the pipe).

we have it in the shifter though, like you cant go from 5th gear to reverse without going back to the center. or that might be in the transmission I dont know.
But i have a 5spd and I cant go into reverse from 5th and im assuming thats reverse lockout.
I think i remember seeing a DIY on how to move some little notch in the shifter to give you 6 gears and reverse when you do the swap or something..

SilverStar
04-22-2008, 07:23 PM
gracias lol...um well im actually thinkin about pickin up a k20z1 exhaust cam. the z3 intake cam in the most aggressive intake cam honda makes so thats stayin lol....but the z3 exhaust cam is the same as the a2. so the z1 exhaust cam should help a lil bit. with my new setup im lookin to make 228whp and 163-ish-wtq

z1 exhaust cam is almost identical to ITR exhaust cam.
does z3 intake cam benefit more if used with rbc intake manifold ??
i think both z1 cams on A2 with prc intake manifold should be pretty good as well.

lldiesel386ll
04-22-2008, 07:23 PM
we have it in the shifter though, like you cant go from 5th gear to reverse without going back to the center. or that might be in the transmission I dont know.
But i have a 5spd and I cant go into reverse from 5th and im assuming thats reverse lockout.
I think i remember seeing a DIY on how to move some little notch in the shifter to give you 6 gears and reverse when you do the swap or something..

you could do that or get the bcss:mwink:
i figure with a piece out like that you may as well replace it for the shorter throws:noidea:

v1c10us
04-22-2008, 07:36 PM
i suppose so
but honestly i feel like it takes longer for me to get it in gear with a stiff chunky short shifter than with the stock one.
you need to push it hard, it resists you, it wont slide in and oyu have to be so durn accurate.
I'd rather just put my palm on the shifter and gently pull it towards me, it goes in smooth as butter and its just as quick as most can shift even with a short shifter.

shadowmd
04-22-2008, 07:56 PM
z1 exhaust cam is almost identical to ITR exhaust cam.
does z3 intake cam benefit more if used with rbc intake manifold ??
i think both z1 cams on A2 with prc intake manifold should be pretty good as well.

yea it does......since the z3 cams from teh factory are paired up with the rbc

lldiesel386ll
04-22-2008, 08:02 PM
i suppose so
but honestly i feel like it takes longer for me to get it in gear with a stiff chunky short shifter than with the stock one.
you need to push it hard, it resists you, it wont slide in and oyu have to be so durn accurate.
I'd rather just put my palm on the shifter and gently pull it towards me, it goes in smooth as butter and its just as quick as most can shift even with a short shifter.

are you calling my car stiff and chunky?:mmad:
lol thats true with most, however i havent had much trouble with neither resistance nor accuracy when i installed mine.
i honestly only did it because id rather not cut when the cuttings been already done (in anticipation of my upcoming swap :mbiggrin:)

ive been thread jacking too much lately...sorry to the op:mfrown:

Princess
04-22-2008, 08:14 PM
...to push it hard, it resists you, it wont slide in and oyu have to be so durn accurate.
I'd rather just put my palm on the shifter and gently pull it towards me, it goes in smooth as butter and its just as quick ...

uh, ok
:pop2:

lldiesel386ll
04-22-2008, 08:20 PM
wow...was i really that tired to have missed those references? awesome

v1c10us
04-22-2008, 08:41 PM
uh, ok
:pop2:

jesus christ thats raunchy
i was reading it going, who the hell said that!
ooo.. haha

lldiesel386ll
04-22-2008, 08:46 PM
:rofl:
now :focus:
im not too sure if this has ever been addressed, but the helm's manual suggests removal through the bottom--is that possible solely with a jack, jackstands, and possibly an engine hoist? otherwise how is the removal process through the top?
: just hoping would fit within the realm of the op's topic:

shadowmd
04-23-2008, 04:33 AM
yes u can drop the subframe

talonXracer
04-23-2008, 05:17 AM
I only swap thru the top, and dont touch the subframe at all. For me it is worlds easier than trying to cordinate a lift and a dolly etc. If you are swapping in a home garage then a simple engine hoist with a load leveler works best IMHO.

Some people drop the subframe/engine while useing the engine hoist to raise the car,,,watching someone do this is like watching a monkey "F" a football,,LOL,,,

r_jones06
04-23-2008, 08:16 AM
what about the VTEC on the a2 swap? How does it work with the ep3 wiring harness? thats really the only part that I am rather confused about.

shadownmd... how do you like those cams... is the idle real rough with those valve springs and retainers?

shadowmd
04-23-2008, 09:00 AM
watching someone do this is like watching a monkey "F" a football,,LOL,,,


LOL


i have lifts so its pretty simple

MOOGEN
04-23-2008, 09:13 AM
yeah man getting a cherry picker makes the swapping life cream.

WhiteOnRice
04-23-2008, 07:25 PM
Yup, I have a hoist and load leveler and it's easy going up and out. I too, won't touch the subframe.

talonXracer
04-23-2008, 08:05 PM
what about the VTEC on the a2 swap? How does it work with the ep3 wiring harness? thats really the only part that I am rather confused about.

shadownmd... how do you like those cams... is the idle real rough with those valve springs and retainers?


Nothing to be confused about. The harnesses are the same except the A2 harness has a reverse lockout(which is of no concern to the engine actually running properly). The A3 DOES indeed have VTEC, just a casterated version. The A3 uses the same exact VTEC solenoid as the a2. The controls are all in the ECU, so as long as the ECU matchs the engine you are good to go.

r_jones06
04-23-2008, 08:09 PM
awesome i appreciate all the info guys :mbiggrin:

shadowmd
04-23-2008, 08:16 PM
as u can see, doug aka talonxracer is the man!

dcmpbl
05-01-2008, 07:08 PM
it is worlds easier than trying to cordinate a lift and a dolly etc. If you are swapping in a home garage then a simple engine hoist with a load leveler works best
Some people drop the subframe/engine while useing the engine hoist to raise the car,,,watching someone do this is like watching a monkey "F" a football,,LOL,,,

Yeah, if you have all the tools that you need or to be borrowed(i.e. load leveler) then maybe this is your choice. If you are put in a hard situation or because you just spent $4000 on an engine you are trying to be frugal about things...dropping the motor and lifting the car is a viable option. For someone that doesn't have any need to OWN a hoist, they will probably borrow one. Aquiring a hoist may be hard enough, let alone a leveler. I've seen it done at Mid-Ohio by peeps that, I imagine, know what they are doing. No one seemed extra horny towards sports equipment ... How do you feel towards those that put an engine on a tire rather than some sweet engine stand? Is that like a giraffe licking its balls?