K24 Engine Swap

[DownTheHatch]

I created this thread for the knowledgeable people on this website to gather information leading to a swap of this engine.

The K24 Honda Motor. With 160hp and 160-lb-ft, this motor is very similar to our K20's except for one big change--torque. 30 more lb-ft's of it, this is due to the upped displacement 2.4 liters, and if torque is what you're looking for then this is the motor for your Si. Right off the bat I see this engine is a great base for an N/A or Turbo build up--it's compression is low.

The K series engines are very similar, which makes swapping parts and swapping engines a breeze. Basically all K series motors use identical mounts. No frankenstein tests have been made yet, but the previous generation of Honda Engines have done well.

The K24 comes supplied with the 2002 CR-V, 2003 Element, and 2003 Accord Sedan. The CR-V engine has always been a favorite of FI, infact the 6th gen of civics do well with the B20 vtec or turbo set up.

Looking at the K24, I see one big difference. This engine features the single-runner intake manifold much like the base model RSX. This places the throttle body deeper in the engine bay. The previous CR-V was known for the "Elephant" intake manifold and was always replaced with a B16 series manifold, I would imagine this would need to be done with the K20 as well. With the K20 intake manifold bolted on to the K24 the dual-runner intake manifold may increase horsepower, though this has not been tried.

Best of all, I would imagine this motor can be had for alot less than the Type-S or Type-R series motors. The CR-V turbo has always been a cheaper alternative to the Type-R.

That's all I have for now,
Jensen

Here is an image of the K24 in the new 2003 Element:

[TEKBRAIN]

The base CRX and the CR-V have the the dual-runner intake manifold. Civic Si and RSX Type-S have the the single-runner intake manifold.

[JoshSI]

So how much does it cost about for a k24? I havent really seen much info about the k24 keep it up!

[hacim]

It would be a great set up. I thought the K24 block is taller then the K20 and it has a longer stroke. Wouldnt the K24 stick out of our engine bay a little? If not that sounds like the most effective way to go. Will our tranny mount up to the K24 without any problems? What about the fuel pump, wll all that need to be replaced? This swap sounds like it needs to be researched, anyone wanna volunteer? Can always email honda tuning and ask them to do an article on it.

[IceD out N CALI]

give it about a year or so-there will be a ton of these which should keep price on these engines low-just hope it fits under the hood:)

[madbrain]

I have both the 02 Si and an 02 CRV and I must say that a swap is definitely doable. As far as the difference in deck height as far as I'm concerned is negligable. Yes the tranny will mount up and the Si fuel system requires no changes for the swap.

I was thinking of using the Si head and manifold on the K24 block due to the better flow rate. I will agree that the K24 in stock form is not a bad stating point.

[ssvr6]

Yeah, and if it is a bit high, it's nothing a custom hood couldn't fix. It's not like you'd need a 4" cowl induction hood.

Steve

[Hondatech]

The K24 blick is 17mm taller then the K20A3 block. I've been meaning to park a block of clay on top of the high point of my motor, and close the hood to see if we've got enough clearence with the stock hood.

I think Hondata brain'd K24 turbo EP3's will soon rule the streets :D

[IceD out N CALI]

Originally posted by Hondatech


I think Hondata brain'd K24 turbo EP3's will soon rule the streets :D

I like the sound of that

[chunky]

close. .. ..

but the ultimate is a true frankenstien setup.

1) JDM ITR head (2002 or up)
2) k24 block, crank
3) rsx-s rods & pistons
4) CTR or ITR transmission (both have shorter final drives than the rsx-s)
5) fully programable ecu.

lots of torque, 8000+rpm redline - might need a new crank for reliability though.


THAT my friends should be the topic of research. i'm hearing mixed reports on wether the ITR/CTR head will fit on the lesser K blocks, but I'm almost positive that they will - but the valvetrain components won't translate over - you have to use the valvetrain that was intended for that particular head.

anyhow, k24 + rsx-s compression + ITR head = probably close to 200ft-lb of torque and over 220hp NORMALLY ASPIRATED. fawk. sign me up.

[myeverlovinsir]

chunky, now your talking, and I like the sound of that!

[Hondatech]

The Type S rods won't work in the K24 block, since the longer stroke K24 has longer rods. Custom forged rods, however....

You're right, for an all motor setup, the ITR head/K24 Block is gonna be pretty hard core.

I wonder though, if the ITR/Type S i-VTEC system will be enormously better for turbo applications over the "regular" i-VTEC as featured in the K24. The intake only i-VTEC may prove better for boost. I guess someone is gonna have to start trying ;)

[chunky]

Originally posted by Hondatech
The Type S rods won't work in the K24 block, since the longer stroke K24 has longer rods. Custom forged rods, however....

d'oh. owned by the hondatech. :D


You're right, for an all motor setup, the ITR head/K24 Block is gonna be pretty hard core.

I wonder though, if the ITR/Type S i-VTEC system will be enormously better for turbo applications over the "regular" i-VTEC as featured in the K24. The intake only i-VTEC may prove better for boost. I guess someone is gonna have to start trying ;)

I think the ITR/CTR/RSX-S heads will prove better for boost simply b/c they flow better (cast from a finer sand, at least in the type-r). They are capable of moving more air with less resistance.

Unlike older VTEC systems where overlap was fixed, it's adjustable in the new motors, so even with the hotter cams found in the type-r heads, you can prevent boost from leaking out during overlap.

[Hondatech]

Unlike older VTEC systems where overlap was fixed, it's adjustable in the new motors, so even with the hotter cams found in the type-r heads, you can prevent boost from leaking out during overlap.

Good point. And with a proper aftermarket turbo grind cam, and some pretty serious tuning, a monster, pure and simple. :D

Time to keep my eyes open for a wrecked '02 CR-V I think....

[yomamaInMySi]

How do you plan to put a type r head on a the K24 engine, when the displacement is different?

[DownTheHatch]

Yomama, it's very doable. The diameter of the pistons aren't changed, it's the length of each cylinder the stroke is longer this is why you get more torque.

[Gibhunter]

It might work fine with Si's head, but RSX Type-S head would introduce such piston speeds that the crank and/or pistons would most likely disintegrate. Currently piston speeds on that car are at the level of Type-S or Type-R (Si's redline but much more piston travel on each stroke). What is strange about that engine is the fact that with the same redline as the Si or base RSX and .4 liters more, it makes the same HP and only about 16TQ more. I think that this engine has allot of potential hidden within it. Change the head to make more power up top (leave the redline alone), free up the intake and exhaust and you should easily be able to see around 180-190 HP at the wheels with that engine.

[slowcivic4now]

Someone mentioned that low compression is THE best way for turbocharging. Is low compression really the best way for turbocharging? Read this: http://www.matt3t4.20m.com/photo5.html
(where it says :"Turbochargers and Compression: The Myth" about 3/4 down the page) ...

[DynaSpeed]

lemme recap Gib - You think that the B18CR pistons with the K24 rods will not hold up? Or the K24 pistons with the K24 rods with stroke of the K24 block will not hold up to the 8k ITR limit?

What about clearance of the B18CR valvetrain on the K24? An issue because of the stroke with the B18CR pistons 11.0:1 pistons?

[Gibhunter]

Originally posted by DynaSpeed
K24 pistons with the K24 rods with stroke of the K24 block will not hold up to the 8k ITR limit

That's what I'm saying.

[02-sir]

Originally posted by slowcivic4now
Someone mentioned that low compression is THE best way for turbocharging. Is low compression really the best way for turbocharging? Read this: http://www.matt3t4.20m.com/photo5.html
(where it says :"Turbochargers and Compression: The Myth" about 3/4 down the page) ...


this was discussed at length on clubrsx

http://forums.clubrsx.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=46445&highlight=matt3t4

(matt3t4 is wrong BTW)

[Hondatech]

FACTORY rods and pistons probably won't survive 8,000 rpm. Forged lightweight aftermarket pistons, rods, rod bolts, main studs, etc. will all likely be an integral part of any very high RPM K24 build. With good aftermarket gear, 8K rpm should be no problem, and you'll have to beat back the power with a stick :D

Mmmmm... High rpm K24 hooked to the uber tight geared JDM Type R trans with the factory LSD..... Or a turbo'd K24 hooked to any K series trans with a good LSD....

I really want a limited slip...

[Hondatech]

BTW, this is a great thread, lets keep it rolling. Input!

[natesi]

Isn't the biggest obstical going to be making our ECU/5 speed work with the K24, or am I missing something?

[Hondatech]

Isn't the biggest obstical going to be making our ECU/5 speed work with the K24, or am I missing something?

Nope. The K24 bolts right onto the 5 speed EP tranny (or the six speed RSX S, or the uber tight ratio six speed ITR or CTR trans for that matter) and uses all the stock mounts. I'd wager that by the time we're ready to engage in any Frankenbuilding, Hondata will have their programmable system available, and we'll be able to tune the ECU to fuel the 2.4L monster.

Step aside H22, there's a new big four in town....

[natesi]

Originally posted by Hondatech


Nope. The K24 bolts right onto the 5 speed EP tranny (or the six speed RSX S, or the uber tight ratio six speed ITR or CTR trans for that matter) and uses all the stock mounts. I'd wager that by the time we're ready to engage in any Frankenbuilding, Hondata will have their programmable system available, and we'll be able to tune the ECU to fuel the 2.4L monster.

Step aside H22, there's a new big four in town....

But we can't just "plug-in" our ECU to the 2.4L can we?

[DjMacAtack]

it would probably go under the same process that the ks0a2 swap on sport compact car where you use the cr-v/accord's engine with ecu and use the honda dealer to reprogram the immobilizer code into the ecu

[natesi]

So that will work with the engine, but how do the gauges work?

[AJWUZHERE]

Originally posted by DjMacAtack
it would probably go under the same process that the ks0a2 swap on sport compact car where you use the cr-v/accord's engine with ecu and use the honda dealer to reprogram the immobilizer code into the ecu


I'm sure the stock ECU will run a frankistiened K engine. the ECU matches up with the head. so if you swap in a k24 block, it should start up just fine. But of corse the best ECU would be one programed for the Franked engine.

Also I remember reading in i think it was honda turner, that a 2.4 liter engine reving at 8000rpm is not very stable even with forgen rods, and crank. this is why the s2000 and ITR are both 2.0 liter, I'm sure honda found 2.0 the best for high revs.

But screw wasting money on a k24 swap when all you need is the block, I'm sure the heads are different and the Si would be better than the CRV/Accord.

[BlackJDMep]

Now Im a bit confused? What would be the BEST swap to do? RSX type R, or k24 block with moded head? Both running on Hondata ECU.

Well I will be selling my 99' EK hatch in about a month, and will ready be ready to start some surgery on my ep. What should I do?

[BlackJDMep]

I meant RSX type r with tranny, or K24 with rsx type r head and tranny (Gotta have that LSD!!)??

[ArcticBlueRsx]

I'd go w/ the K24 =)

[madbrain]

Find a wrecked CRV with a K24 5 spd. with real time 4WD and use the tranny, transfer case, and modify the rear and have an all wheel drive Si. If your gonna do it go all the way.