Blew 2 cylinders

[Piga]

So I was at the track and on my 2nd pass I was at the top of 3rd and went to put it in 4th and it slipped into 2nd gear. As soon as that happened I put it in neutral. But I also had to drive home which was a 45 min drive. The car ran fine except for the stop to go take offs it would jerk and stutter until you hit 2k rpms.

So the next day I checked the compression of each cylinder and cylinders 1 and 3 showed 120 compression, while 4 and 2 showed 0 compression.

I don't have much money and I don't plan on doing swaps of any sort. I just need to fix it for it to be my DD again.

I need some input on what I need to do to fix this. Should I just get a new head?

Thanks,
Piga

[mustclime]

check your valve lash....if it way off on those cyclinders, you bent some valves....

[makavelibranded]

thats sucks dude gl, a3's are not really too expensive if its bad enough

i put it in 2nd instead of 4th once when i 1st got the car and was learning to drive, but was just cruising and stopped it at 6k

[Piga]

People assumed that I had bent some valves. So what would be the best way to fix this? Get a new head or whole motor? Or rebuild what I have?

[MR.Pizza]

Find a new engine, it will be cheaper than fixing that head.

[Piga]

So I should replace the whole engine (head and block)? If that were to happen would I need to get a new ecu or can I keep the one I have now?

[Lucid Moments]

I would replace the whole motor too. A3's are cheap enough that its probably worth it, but you can swap just the head if you want to. Either way you can keep using the stock ECU as long as its either an A3 motor or head.

[Piga]

Do you guys know wher I can get a good a3 for a cheap price? Or would you guys trust a junkyard. This junkyard that I know off said they'd sell me the whole a3 motor minus the tranny for $350.

[BlownSi05]

yeah i would look for a new motor or get an a2/z1 head or something. i replaced my valve train. if i had it to do over again i would have just bought a new head.

[mustclime]

If it was me....I would get a k24a4 motor....they are cheap ( I have seen them go for as little as 400 bucks and no more than 1000). You can run it with your stock ecu + some 310cc injectors and it is more or less a easy swap.....and you will pickup a extra 400cc's in displacemnt. :mwink:


read through this thread......

http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?p=529320#post529320

[Piga]

In "additional parts" it said I would need KPro for the K24a4 swap.

[mustclime]

In "additional parts" it said I would need KPro for the K24a4 swap.

k-pro is not needed.....the motor will run fine with your ecu, the 310cc injectors from a type-s /tsx will make up for the change in mixture.....do you know what kpro uses for a base map for the k24a4 motor? a k20a3 map.:mangel:

[Piga]

Ahh, I see. What about that sway bar part and exhaust. Why won't those fit?

[talonXracer]

If you are new to the game, then it probably wouldnt be best to attempt a hybrid swap like a K24. You have two choices for no issue swaps
1. another bone stock A3.
2. a K20A2 w/trans and ECU from a RSX typeS.(a little more involved due to immobilizor resynching)

[Piga]

Yeah, I'm just gonna go with the a3 because I don't plan on making the EP a project car. But what I don't understand is why can't I just swap heads? Why do I have to swap the entire motor?

[clujalolo]

because u dont know what has happened as to piston damage. you could take your head off and take a quick look. You could try just buying a k20a3 head, those are dirt cheap.

[Lucid Moments]

Yeah, I'm just gonna go with the a3 because I don't plan on making the EP a project car. But what I don't understand is why can't I just swap heads? Why do I have to swap the entire motor?

You can just swap heads. But like clujalolo said you don't know what other damage might have happened during the misshift. Maybe nothing, maybe something. And an entire motor would be cheap insurance as long as you know who you bought it from.

[Piga]

Well I am going to open my original head and check for damage on the pistons but this salvage yard I'm going to tomorrow has 2 k20a3 motors for 350 each and one mite even come with the tranny cuz this yard doesn't care for imports much and gives stuff away dirt cheap.

[BeaterEP]

Well I am going to open my original head and check for damage on the pistons but this salvage yard I'm going to tomorrow has 2 k20a3 motors for 350 each and one mite even come with the tranny cuz this yard doesn't care for imports much and gives stuff away dirt cheap.

A: Sorry to hear about your troubles, but at least it looks like you can get your motor replaced pretty cheap.

B: We'll be needing a complete listing of all the other "worthless import" parts they've got laying around. :mbiggrin:

[Ep3some]

^^^^^I second that part B. If they have any A2's hanging around I would love to take one off their hands.

[weltall]

k-pro is not needed.....the motor will run fine with your ecu, the 310cc injectors from a type-s /tsx will make up for the change in mixture.....do you know what kpro uses for a base map for the k24a4 motor? a k20a3 map.:mangel:

im sorry scott but that is incorrect information

i just looked through the calibrations and they are infact different
i compared the stock tune of the k20a3 to the accord (the only non tsx k24 tune it is infact a stock calibration so accord/crv tune)
both the fuel , timing , (didnt look at cam angles) and the injector trim is 270 not 310

i also didnt compare the individual cam angle maps for fuel and timing



however from a tuning stand point the k20a3 map is used as a starting point for tuning the k24a4 but needs tuning none the less

[ep3k20a2]

sucks to hear that... but if u have no compression in two cylinders then u need a new block not a new head

[weltall]

if the valves cannot seat from being bent that would cause compression loss

and i have seen heads get fucked up but not do shit to the block

[Piga]

B: We'll be needing a complete listing of all the other "worthless import" parts they've got laying around. :mbiggrin:

Trust me, if they had a2's that cheap then I would be going for that. One yard did offer me $1200 for an a2 head.

Update is the motor is going to be tore apart on Saturday morning. And I am looking at motors today in the afternoon.

[TigerBallZ]

If I could get A3 motors for $350 each at my local junkyards, I would buy both of them. Ask the junkyard how much the transmission is shipped to 37128, and then pm me. I would replace the whole motor if it's that cheap. By the time you tear it down to figure out what is broken, buy replacement parts, and reassemble, you could swap the motor and be back on the road. $350 for a A3 is dirt cheap.

[Piga]

First yard has the a3 motor for $600. They also have an 03 k24a4.

Then the yard across the street offered up just the head for $400 and the entire motor for $2200.

[mustclime]

im sorry scott but that is incorrect information

i just looked through the calibrations and they are infact different
i compared the stock tune of the k20a3 to the accord (the only non tsx k24 tune it is infact a stock calibration so accord/crv tune)
both the fuel , timing , (didnt look at cam angles) and the injector trim is 270 not 310

i also didnt compare the individual cam angle maps for fuel and timing



however from a tuning stand point the k20a3 map is used as a starting point for tuning the k24a4 but needs tuning none the less


fyi, the k24a4 motor has a intake cam part#14110-ppa-010 and a ex cam part# of 11120-ppa-010........the same part#s as the k20a3 cams(04-05)( dam honda for using parts across models and motors) ......so the timing is the dam close to the same. My recomendation for the 310cc injectors was to offset the fact that the ep3 ecu would be running leaner than you would need for the k24a4 motor( I know the stock accord comes with 270's stock) . As for there being a k24a4 cal, that is pretty new, in the past hondadata just told people to use the ep3 cal and work from there.

I would only suggest this course if I thought it would not work, there were a couple of people that ran this setup and I would post a link if the info had not been lost in the great GO_DADDY crash of april....but what ever.

[talonXracer]

There have been several cases where a stock K24A1/A4 have been swapped into the EP3, with no bolt-ons, a set of RSXtypeS 310cc injectors, and the stock EP3 ecu has worked wonderfully. Contact Davis for some more info on this or just try a search as it has been covered already.

[weltall]

still the higher displacement and with larger injectors there are significant differences in the tune

like hondata said its used as a starting point and needs to be tuned

i can imagine the driveability and other parthrottle issues especially in the lower rpms with bigger injectors

as minor as they maybe its still present


the same cams dont matter as far as cam angle maps and timing the car will react differently due to the higher displacment and thats like telling me if i swap out for tsx cams all i would have to do is load the tsx values for cam and timing and ill still pull 500+ when i know damn wel it wont work right