K20Z1 into my 02 EP3, what will I need?

[SHG_EasyE]

Hey guys, Im picking up a full 05 Z1 swap in the next couple weeks and Id like to start piecing everything together I will need for installation. So far I know I need the Dakota Digital converter box for the VSS signal, as well as a cable operated throttle body.

As far as an ECU, if possible, Id like to just be able to run a stock A2 ECU. Ive read that I will use my oem EP3 engine harness, but do I need to add any wires or change pins in order to run the Z1? Ive searched but so far I havent found any clear and definitive answers.

Thanks for any help in advance guys!

[BaLisTek]

im almost more excited to see you totally go apeshit cleaning your engine bay before you drop the z1 haha

[spartan]

I'm doin the same swap, an from what i've found out you can use everything from your K20A3 motor even then trans. Can't use most of the internals tho.
I have no idea what a Dakota Digital converter box is.
And the ive read people have problems with the Z1 transmission speed sensor.
So I'm gonna get an ITR trans ($2200)
or A2 trans w/ lsd stage 2 clutch kit & lightened flywheel an maybe ITR final drive. ($2100)
now tell me that doesn't sound bad ass.

[SHG_EasyE]

I'm doin the same swap, an from what i've found out you can use everything from your K20A3 motor even then trans. Can't use most of the internals tho.
I have no idea what a Dakota Digital converter box is.
And the ive read people have problems with the Z1 transmission speed sensor.
So I'm gonna get an ITR trans ($2200)
or A2 trans w/ lsd stage 2 clutch kit & lightened flywheel an maybe ITR final drive. ($2100)
now tell me that doesn't sound bad ass.

The dakota converter is so you can run the Z1 trans with speed sensor. That way I can keep the engine/trans together and not spend money on something else.

[mr.brightside]

i would just buy the z1 motor and 02-04 type s 6 speed and just run kpro with no problems. maybe even save some money and use your a3 5speed and add a 6th gear. add a bcss you should have no problems with that reverse lock out stuff. and like the other dude said you can reuse most of the a3's accessories except oil pump among other things. i think there is an issue with the z1 oil cooler too but not too sure about that. for the most part z1 motor + a2 trans + kpro = straight forward. if your looking for more in depth info i would go ahead and pm talonXracer...he will have answers to it all...good luck!

[Sucka]

im almost more excited to see you totally go apeshit cleaning your engine bay before you drop the z1 haha

+2

[SHG_EasyE]

i would just buy the z1 motor and 02-04 type s 6 speed and just run kpro with no problems. maybe even save some money and use your a3 5speed and add a 6th gear. add a bcss you should have no problems with that reverse lock out stuff. and like the other dude said you can reuse most of the a3's accessories except oil pump among other things. i think there is an issue with the z1 oil cooler too but not too sure about that. for the most part z1 motor + a2 trans + kpro = straight forward. if your looking for more in depth info i would go ahead and pm talonXracer...he will have answers to it all...good luck!

I'm not clear on why running the z1 trans is such an issue. Other than having to convert the vss signal what else makes it so hard to use? I'd rather deal with some minor issues than have to try and sell this trans and find another one with similar low mileage.

Also, why would I need to use the a3 oil pump? And what are you referring to with the oil cooler? It's just a coolant passage around the oil filter mount no?

[POOPTOOTH]

Hey guys, Im picking up a full 05 Z1 swap in the next couple weeks and Id like to start piecing everything together I will need for installation. So far I know I need the Dakota Digital converter box for the VSS signal, as well as a cable operated throttle body.

As far as an ECU, if possible, Id like to just be able to run a stock A2 ECU. Ive read that I will use my oem EP3 engine harness, but do I need to add any wires or change pins in order to run the Z1? Ive searched but so far I havent found any clear and definitive answers.

Thanks for any help in advance guys!

You can definitely use your harness, you just wont have reverse lockout, which in mine and many others opinion is rather useless in a LHD car. But knowing you, I'm sure you can always pin it out and add to your harness.

As for the A2 ecu, IMO I wouldn't. For one, the cams are a little different. So right there you're fuel/cam tables are not going to be a2 spec. So it might run a little lean?

Either way, the car will be a dog with an stock A2 computer. You should definitely do kpro at some point in your near future.

Looking forward to your attention to detail with this!!

[lldiesel386ll]

http://www.hybrid-racing.com/products/hr-05-06-speedconverter-sensor/

hybrid racing also makes a converter box for the vss signal :thumbu:

[SHG_EasyE]

You can definitely use your harness, you just wont have reverse lockout, which in mine and many others opinion is rather useless in a LHD car. But knowing you, I'm sure you can always pin it out and add to your harness.

As for the A2 ecu, IMO I wouldn't. For one, the cams are a little different. So right there you're fuel/cam tables are not going to be a2 spec. So it might run a little lean?

Either way, the car will be a dog with an stock A2 computer. You should definitely do kpro at some point in your near future.

Looking forward to your attention to detail with this!!

Ok, Im assuming that the reverse lockout is a solenoid that keeps the shift fork from going into reverse position? If I end up not using this feature I can just remove the solenoid and put a plug in its place.


Other than the reverse lockout is there anything that needs to be changed on the harness?


So so far here is what I know I need...

- Dakota digital vss signal conversion box
- stock A3 throttle body
- Run pins for reverse lockout or remove reverse lockout solenoid
- Buddy Club Short shifter for 6th gear (or mod oem shifter)
- Kpro

[POOPTOOTH]

Sounds about right so far. Also I noticed Nyquil just did this exact swap into his EP recently. He might be able to better assist you since he just wrapped his up.

[johnkimble]

z1 tranny is no big deal, really. it will work just fine, but your speedo won't. i've heard that the dakota box is really straight forward. my mechanic swears by them. also i wouldn't even worry about reverse lockout. reverse is way over there

as for the short shifter, some people have even had to modify their BCSS for 6th. i will be dropping in an a2 and i'm just going to notch the oem one if i need to, it's no big deal w/a dremel. BCSS is just an extra expense imo. pic below for reference:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1501756/0212scc_civichybrid02_zoom.jpg

[lbk02si]

http://www.hybrid-racing.com/products/hr-05-06-speedconverter-sensor/

hybrid racing also makes a converter box for the vss signal :thumbu:

Yes they do, I have it, but it does not display the correct speed for some reason? They have offered to reflash the chip but I just never did it. In no way though am I saying they don't make good stuff bc I've used other stuff from them. I just think an adjustable unit would be better

[SHG_EasyE]

Sounds about right so far. Also I noticed Nyquil just did this exact swap into his EP recently. He might be able to better assist you since he just wrapped his up.

Cool Ill shoot him a pm!


z1 tranny is no big deal, really. it will work just fine, but your speedo won't. i've heard that the dakota box is really straight forward. my mechanic swears by them. also i wouldn't even worry about reverse lockout. reverse is way over there

as for the short shifter, some people have even had to modify their BCSS for 6th. i will be dropping in an a2 and i'm just going to notch the oem one if i need to, it's no big deal w/a dremel. BCSS is just an extra expense imo. pic below for reference:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1501756/0212scc_civichybrid02_zoom.jpg

Thanks for the input man, I will probably just end up notching the oem shifter to save some coin. Im going with the Dakota box since it's adjustable and not a preset unit. That way even if the conversion is off a tad you can adjust it to be as accurate as possible at normal cruising speed (55-75)

[SHG_EasyE]

Bump for more info.

[johnkimble]

this may help you -- some notes I've put together:



1. Need to replace RSX-S power steering pump with EP3 idler pulley
2. Use EP3 belt with washers to extend alternator pulley outwards
Note from forum: I found that simply adding a washer or two between the Alternator and block allows the stock Si belt to fit and the belt has the proper tension, with the arrow deadnuts center. The proper bolts have MORE than enough length, but getting some bolts that are 5mm longer will not hurt, if you are concerned.
3. Use EP3 axles
4. The stock grounding connection may be different


it's also a good time to get the Hondata IMG, some bling bling radiator hoses, stainless steel clutch lines, motor mount inserts etc.

[classiccelica]

I have the 03 type-s six speed in my ep and I use the bcss. The only draw back to the bcss is it feels lost sometimes as it isn't factory equipment. But it does shorten the shifts very nicely and you shouldn't have to notch it at all.

[spartan]

I have the 03 type-s six speed in my ep and I use the bcss. The only draw back to the bcss is it feels lost sometimes as it isn't factory equipment. But it does shorten the shifts very nicely and you shouldn't have to notch it at all.

What do you mean it feels "lost"

[classiccelica]

What do you mean it feels "lost"

Well sometimes especially if you are tired and driving home or something the shifter will get in caught in between the actual gears. Usually though that doesn't happen. I have had it happen a few times after working swing shifts then going graveyard right afterward.

[SHG_EasyE]

this may help you -- some notes I've put together:



it's also a good time to get the Hondata IMG, some bling bling radiator hoses, stainless steel clutch lines, motor mount inserts etc.

Thanks man that alternator spacing is a great tip!


I have the 03 type-s six speed in my ep and I use the bcss. The only draw back to the bcss is it feels lost sometimes as it isn't factory equipment. But it does shorten the shifts very nicely and you shouldn't have to notch it at all.

Yeah Im hesitant to changing the oem shifter since mine, even with the stock rubber bushings, is so crisp and exact. I will probably just notch the stock shifter.

[classiccelica]

Thanks man that alternator spacing is a great tip!



Yeah Im hesitant to changing the oem shifter since mine, even with the stock rubber bushings, is so crisp and exact. I will probably just notch the stock shifter.

Well that may end up making it feel the same way as the bcss. I have no clue as I haven't done it.

[k20choie]

I have an 05 z1 with z1 tranny in my 03 ep:
-used stock ep3 harnesses (i believe going this route theres no repinning required)
-a2 ecu reprogrammed at dealer (kpro, of course, preferred)
-used dakota box for speedo (cut female VSS plug off z1 harness and soldered to ep3 harness for a clean look) then used gps as a reference to adjust speed as needed
-stock axles, a/c compressor, swap psp for ep3 idler pulley and bought a new 7-rib? belt specified for ep3 (couldnt find the exact length i needed)
-05 z1 headers, type-r or type-s midpipe, with stock muffler
-did not have to mod shifter (all stock)
-knock sensor is different so look out for that (may have to reuse ep3 knock sensor)

i think that covers everything i encountered. thats all i remember for now... pm if you need more info.

oh yes, i have pin outs for the a3 and z1 if you need. i tried using the z1 ecu but couldnt get evap codes to go away even though i repinned the z1 harness...might have fried the z1 ecu when i was trying things out. i got it started and everything but just couldnt get those codes to disappear...so i defaulted to an a2 ecu.

[02TWSI]

Well sometimes especially if you are tired and driving home or something the shifter will get in caught in between the actual gears. Usually though that doesn't happen. I have had it happen a few times after working swing shifts then going graveyard right afterward.

this happens with me once in a while with 5th gear on my a2 trans w/ bcss

I go from fourth to where fifth SHOULD be but it doesnt go in, so I go down to 6th and then go back to 5th and its fine...i love my setup but I want to try those mtec springs out..

[Andrew]

just throwing this out there, but if you don't want to buy the speed converter you can always use your ep3 trans case and put the z1 gearing in it and no need for a speed converter. you'll just have left over gears/z1 case

[Blue03Si]

I've been really wanting to do a K20A2 swap, but now I'm seriously considering the Z1 or the Z3. If I did either of those I think I would just KPRO my ECU, gut my ep3 transmission and swap over the internals from the Z1 or Z3 transmission and get an RBC intake manifold to use the original throttle body. I seem to remember reading somewhere that the A2 and the A3 crank pulleys are different diameters. I wonder that if you swap the A3 crank pulley if that would fix the belt length problem.

[wlls]

I did this swap its worth it