k20a2 cams in k24a2

[Paulieep3]

I have pretty much teh complete internals of a k20a2 head and wanna install in my k24a2. ive been searching the threads and can only find stuff on this setup into an a3. I know how to perform the work, i just wanna know if all im gonna have to work about is making sure that the cams are aligned at TDC with the crank. If so i wanna make sure that i wont run into a problem of valve clash. and how hard is it going to be to tune the new setup.

[talonXracer]

Well there is absolutely no difference between the heads internals really, other than camshaft profiles, no need to swap anything but the camshafts. Depending on if it is a 06+ K24A2, the K20A2 camshaft swap would be a serious downgrade prior to VTEC engagement with only very minor gains up top. The combo that seems to work very well is a 06+ TSX intake camshaft with a 05+ typeS exhaust cam.

Make sure to follow the K24 manual as far as camshaft timing and not the K20A2.

[Paulieep3]

I have a 04 k24, i was told that the valve springs are not as strong on this motor and that the k20 ones are slightly better. Also i got all the stuff for 90 dollars, he had a 04 type s, blew the bottom end of his motor and went and bought a 06 k24(bastard) and sold me the cams and whatever else i wanted to grab for 90 bucks, so i took it all lol, but if the springs are the same, ill leave my stock ones, less work anyway. The bottom of the head had minor damage though so i left that and the valves.

what k24 manual are you talking about? do i buy it somewhere or can i look it up online and download. I do most of my work just from general knowledge, this is my first time swapping something internal that isnt originally there though.

figured for the price i paid for the cams it was worth the upgrade. im hoping to actually beable to get 40 degree instead of 25 like i do. also i wanted to get higher lift.

[VIZHUNZ02SI]

talon is right its a down grade. Get 06+ tsx cams and call it a day. Be carefully where you get your info. Dont be the noob that wants to buy everything dc5 cause they think its better cause its from a dc5

[Paulieep3]

talon is right its a down grade. Get 06+ tsx cams and call it a day. Be carefully where you get your info. Dont be the noob that wants to buy everything dc5 cause they think its better cause its from a dc5

I thought it was a upgrade for 04 k24a2 and downgrade for 06 k24a2. maybe the springs are the same, but my cams just wont turn to the 40 degree command. is there a problem with my motor then?

[japarossa]

Get the intake cam gear modified like it says on the hondata site and you will be able to turn 40* no problem.

http://www.hondata.com/tuning_k24a2_tsx_engine.html

[i11 b3havior]

I have an 02 dc5 vtc gear but not sure if I want to put it in or not what are the chances of v2p contact ?

[Paulieep3]

Iwas just reading that page, and from what im getting, putting in the the vtc machanism will give me my lift just how i need, but its better to leave the intake cam alone, because i will lose a lot of low end torque? so should i replace the vtc mechanism and just put the exhaust cam on?

[Paulieep3]

I have an 02 dc5 vtc gear but not sure if I want to put it in or not what are the chances of v2p contact ?

on the hondata site, it said you can run 45* safely, but because the clearance is smaller than k20 its risky running the full 50*

[i11 b3havior]

yea I know that 45 is the highest safe but there is settings for it I think i'm just going to wait and get mine machined and just not run the risk !!! where in palm beach are you ? i am in west palm

[japarossa]

I wouldn't run the full 50* vtc on a k24a2, any chance of v2p contact is to much for me.

[Paulieep3]

I just wanted to run the 40* that the kpro cam command says instead of 25*, im not gonna waste money on getting my cam machined, i have all the k20a2 stuff, so i should beable to get the lift with out that. i live in boynton, you ever go to any meets anywhere?

[i11 b3havior]

yea I hear ya it is pretty expensive for that little bit of a machining I just moved out of boynton 2 weeks ago I'm surprised I haven't seen you around before ? nah no meets do you know of any ?

[i11 b3havior]

I wouldn't run the full 50* vtc on a k24a2, any chance of v2p contact is to much for me.

thats exactly how I feel !!! but it is also just sitting there and have heard of people using it with no issues at all

[Paulieep3]

yea I hear ya it is pretty expensive for that little bit of a machining I just moved out of boynton 2 weeks ago I'm surprised I haven't seen you around before ? nah no meets do you know of any ?

you probably have, my car dont look like my avatar anymore, its champ white/matte black 2-tone now. but its alsonot my daily so she sits at home alot.
the only meet i actually go to is in boca, and sometime theres one over on lantana and 441


im doing more reading on this hondata site and really just trying to decide... i think i may just swap the vtc mechanism and leave my cams, it says the our lower cams are all larger, just the higher one isnt, but then the power im gonna gain up top to the power im gonna lose down low isnt worth it, so it would be best just to change the vtc mech.

[i11 b3havior]

where and when is it in boca ? I work in pompano

[talonXracer]

There is a chance of uncommanded full 50 degree cam advance occuring. This can happen when the ECU is doing readiness checks. I would have the stock TSX VTC mech machined for 45 degrees, it is not that bad cost wise really, especially compared to having to rebuild or replace the engine.


I just wanted to run the 40* that the kpro cam command says instead of 25*, im not gonna waste money on getting my cam machined, i have all the k20a2 stuff, so i should beable to get the lift with out that.

It is not the cam that gets machined, it is just the inner chamber within the VTC mech.

VTC does not generate any additional lift, it just adjusts where and when the lift occurs.

[AKEP]

im sitting in an uncomfortable chair so i kinda skimmed through here. if you have the vtc gear from the dc5 then you're good, just swap it out with the k24a2 one. just make sure your tune doesn't go past 45*.

sell all 4 of those cams, and get rbb2 cams (05-06 tsx).

[japarossa]

im sitting in an uncomfortable chair so i kinda skimmed through here. if you have the vtc gear from the dc5 then you're good, just swap it out with the k24a2 one. just make sure your tune doesn't go past 45*.

sell all 4 of those cams, and get rbb2 cams (05-06 tsx).

Like said before, even if you tune the dc5 vtc to 45* it can still go past that right to 50* and you will probably be rebuilding the motor. The reason to machine the vtc mechanism is to stop it from being able to go to 50* ever whether its during readiness checks or a misshift.

[AKEP]

when is the readiness set? after start up?

[AKEP]

http://www.k20a.org/forum/showthread.php?t=61319

there was a point made, do they have issues running a k20 head (im guessing also with k20 50* vtc) on a k24 block.

i mean, i have my ep3 vtc gear on my k24a2, and i've started it and let it warm up just fine. but i dont know for sure whats going on cause i haven't driven more than 30 ft.

[VIZHUNZ02SI]

I thought it was a upgrade for 04 k24a2 and downgrade for 06 k24a2. maybe the springs are the same, but my cams just wont turn to the 40 degree command. is there a problem with my motor then?

04 k24a2 is not as powerful as the 06+. so if you took a 04 head and placed k20a2 cam you're gonna lose mid range just to make very little hp up top. now it you got 06 k24a2 cams thats and upgrade from the 04 cam profile. as far as the vtc gear not hitting 40 degrees is simple. you need to A:modify the stock 25 degree vtc gear its self like how hondata has theirs to 45 degree vtc gear. or B: get a 50 degree vtc gear from k20a2 and slap it on. i will warn you. take it to a good turner that can bring out max power when dealing with a 50 degree vtc gear. most people avoid it due to v2p

[talonXracer]

The issue is with piston valve pocket design on the TSX pistons, not with the head, the heads are virtually identicle in the combustion chamber shape, displacement and valve/rocker/cam position.


Readiness is checked when certain parameters are met, not just starting, or mileage etc, but a whole slew of factors. Readiness is also not simply checked one time and all is good, but continuesly as the parameters are met.

[Paulieep3]

Ok, im convinced, im sure i can sell all this A2 head stuff for a profit anyway and just get the mechanism machined, will probably do that, and just use that for a while until i get some extra money together for newer cams, i will probly try the combo that talon suggested with the intake/exhaust from different motors.
now next question is with the amount of money im gonna spend getting 06 tsx cams and z1 cams would it be more beneficial to just buy aftermarket cams?
and if i buy aftermarket cams, or use those cams am i gonna have to buy new springs and retainers to avoid any valve float?





where and when is it in boca ? I work in pompano


Monday nights at like 9:30 at the five guys, that meet gets pretty thick.

[Paulieep3]

Oh yea, also, who on the site machines the mechanism for a good price? or what company can i send it too to get it done? and what is the average price i should be looking to pay?

[talonXracer]

The typeS springs and retainers will fit the TSX head and provide protection against valve float seeing the K24 CAN not rev reliably to the typeS's rev limit.

Do not let those rockers go cheaply, a NIB rocker costs 180$ and a Kseries uses 8 rockers. The internal locking pins and springs parts of the rockers are not sold individually and can and will launch across the garage if you are not carefull !!!

[Paulieep3]

The typeS springs and retainers will fit the TSX head and provide protection against valve float seeing the K24 CAN not rev reliably to the typeS's rev limit.

Do not let those rockers go cheaply, a NIB rocker costs 180$ and a Kseries uses 8 rockers. The internal locking pins and springs parts of the rockers are not sold individually and can and will launch across the garage if you are not carefull !!!

Noted.... so it would actually be a good idea to change out the springs and retainers after i get the mechanism done since ill have it all apart anyway. just fro some added protection.

[talonXracer]

It sure wouldnt hurt to install the typeS springs and retainers. It also wouldnt hurt to change out the valve stem seals, very cheap insurance.

[Paulieep3]

It sure wouldnt hurt to install the typeS springs and retainers. It also wouldnt hurt to change out the valve stem seals, very cheap insurance.

Very good call, will deff do that, any idea best place to get the mechanism machined? I want to send it to someone who knows wtf they are doing.

[japarossa]

Any local machine shop will be able to machine the VTC, just take them a print out of the hondata page so they can see the measurements and what part needs to be machined.

[talonXracer]

Hytech exhaust usually has a few already modified, if not then you would send yours in and John would machine it and get it back to ya. his Kseries engine stuff is on a different site than Hytech, it can be found here, http://rsx-tuners.com/home.php