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View Full Version : 4 lug brake upgrade options, AEM big brake kit, RSX calipers?



cyllarus
07-03-2011, 08:38 PM
Hey guys, I have a question regarding brake upgrades for a 4 lug '02.

I am researching brake upgrades for the 02 civic and have done some searching for different options but wanted to lay them out here and get all your advice on it.

- pads SS lines, rotors. this is the most basic upgrade as i understand,but i was hoping for something that would give a bit more stopping power and pedal feel.

- RSX calipers / rotors,: how much of an improvement is this really? and is this even possible without going to 5 lug setup on my car?

- AEM big brake kit: i seem to find references to the AEM brake kits that use a larger rotor, and a spacer to move the caliper out so that it works with the new rotor. are these still available? and if so how much do they cost? How is brake pedal feel with these?

-OEM replcements:are there larger calipers / rotors from other honda cars that can be fited to the ep3 (with mild modifications) to our cars?

27rocks
07-03-2011, 08:46 PM
Rsx-s is a great upgrade. However you have to go 5 lug, but that's a good thing. More wheel options....

First i'm going to ask why are you looking at a brake upgrade? Are you experiencing brake fade?

cyllarus
07-03-2011, 09:14 PM
Hey rocks,
you're the exact person i was hoping would reply, all your advice seems knowledgeable, and experienced.

the car is a DD, and big brake upgrades like wild wood are too $$ for me right now. overall my feelings are that the pedal feel is crap, and that under hevy breaking, i simply dont have confidence in the stock setup.

RXS brakes are a no go b/c i would have to swap to 5 lug, which means i would have to buy new rims.

I was hoping someone would have some info on the AEM big rotor kits, since i think thats the kind of performance im after. hower the change in front / back brake balance concerns me.

hyu
07-03-2011, 10:35 PM
It always seemed that 4x100 had way more wheel options?
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/WIL-140-6163--220-6860.html

Hell these seem good too
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/STP-979-40003.html

Seems pretty cheap to me? about the same price as a decent 5 lug swap. Don't forget you'll need to sell your rims and buy a new set as well

27rocks
07-04-2011, 08:02 AM
Hey rocks,
you're the exact person i was hoping would reply, all your advice seems knowledgeable, and experienced.

the car is a DD, and big brake upgrades like wild wood are too $$ for me right now. overall my feelings are that the pedal feel is crap, and that under hevy breaking, i simply dont have confidence in the stock setup.

RXS brakes are a no go b/c i would have to swap to 5 lug, which means i would have to buy new rims.

I was hoping someone would have some info on the AEM big rotor kits, since i think thats the kind of performance im after. hower the change in front / back brake balance concerns me.


It always seemed that 4x100 had way more wheel options?
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/WIL-140-6163--220-6860.html

Hell these seem good too
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/STP-979-40003.html

Seems pretty cheap to me? about the same price as a decent 5 lug swap. Don't forget you'll need to sell your rims and buy a new set as well
Ok here's my advise. Since you're on a budget and want to keep your current wheels you only have one good option. But before we get to that i want to throw some things out there...

As far as the Willwood kit goes i would pass on it (don't really need them). The only thing that's appealing about it is the fact you get 4 piston calipers and that's it. The rotors are still small in comparison to stock. If you buy a BBK you buy it because you are having heat issues under hard braking so you want something with more material to dissipate that heat and cool faster. Well you cant really do that with something pretty much the same size if you are already having issues to begin with on the stock set.
The second option which i think is by far the best not only for performance but also for the amount of $$. New good aggressive pads, ss lines and top notch fluid will up the temps on your brakes before they start getting to hot and give you good solid bite. I would also skip on drilled or slotted rotors. We're on a budget here and that's one thing you honestly don't need and can save a pretty penny on. Cheap blanks will be plenty good and they will work pretty much identically as any other name brand slotted/drilled rotor out there.

Now if you still run into temp issues at the end of long straights i would honestly look into making some kind of ventilation to the front brakes. All you need is two brake ducts from the front bumper which should keep the temps way down.
http://image.musclemustangfastfords.com/f/8867567/mmfp_0707_08_z+2007_steeda_Q335_mustang+brake_cool ing_ducts.jpg

lbk02si
07-04-2011, 08:21 AM
I had ebc slotted rotors, ss lines and motul fluid and barely noticed any difference. I'm running the 4 lug stop tech BBK and I absolutely love it! Much better braking now!

27rocks
07-04-2011, 08:47 AM
I had ebc slotted rotors, ss lines and motul fluid and barely noticed any difference. I'm running the 4 lug stop tech BBK and I absolutely love it! Much better braking now!You forgot to add the pads that's why lol.

hyu
07-04-2011, 09:03 AM
Allot of ep owners take the splash shield off in the wheel well so it ventilates allot better. Plus its a free mod

27rocks
07-04-2011, 09:13 AM
Allot of ep owners take the splash shield off in the wheel well so it ventilates allot better. Plus its a free modTrue!! But its such a PITA to take it off if you don't have the entire knuckle off of the car. Bending it back as much as possible is an easier way to go about it then putting the vent tubing right in front of it should work well.
I remember taking mine off and it was a bitch even when i had nothing but the knuckle in front of me lol. You basically have to cut it off once you unscrew the 3 little screws between the hub and knuckle.

AKEP
07-04-2011, 09:20 AM
that stop tech kit looks promising. not a bad price either. with ss lines on my bike i can feel the motul600 expand. i know its not ep but yeah, all new lines rotors pads and fluid, should be pretty sweet.

27rocks
07-04-2011, 09:39 AM
that stop tech kit looks promising. not a bad price either. with ss lines on my bike i can feel the motul600 expand. i know its not ep but yeah, all new lines rotors pads and fluid, should be pretty sweet.It does but way over priced.
Same performance with:
Front + Rear blank rotors $66
http://www.streetbeatcustoms.com/2003/Honda/Civic-HB/Brakes/Brake-Rotors/
If you want Axxis pads Front's $80 Rears $60
http://www.buybrakes.com/store/45-04650U
http://www.buybrakes.com/store/45-05370U
Russlle SS brake lines $90 (BTW is that Gaurdians car at the top??)
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/RUS-684890.html
And i use ATE brake fluid which runs around $15

Total = ~ $315 give or take

MugenReplica
07-04-2011, 09:58 AM
For the amount of money you are talking for an upgrade, you can get a Wilwood brake kit from Corsport for about $608 shipped with lines, less rotating mass and easy replacement rings. If you actually plan on tracking it, this is the best low buck setup for 4 lugs. Lucid Moments tracks his Ep3 with this exact setup.

http://www.corsportusa.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=179&products_id=5522&osCsid=26929f4acb6e63c8d74d2849f1cb12b0


A DIY oem big brake kit would be redrilled to 4x100 RSX-S rotors (there are guys who've done it on here), CRV/DC2 ITR calipers (much bigger piston for more clamping force), CRV Hawk HPS pads and SS lines.

http://incredilution.com/wp-content/gallery/Pictures/RL%20Caliper%20bracket/RSX%20Rotor.jpg
redrill RSX-S rotor like so...


Last option would be HPS pads, SS lines, and some DOT 4 fluid(which should be standard on all of these upgrades if you brake alot).

27rocks
07-04-2011, 10:19 AM
For the amount of money you are talking for an upgrade, you can get a Wilwood brake kit from Corsport for about $608 shipped with lines, less rotating mass and easy replacement rings. If you actually plan on tracking it, this is the best low buck setup for 4 lugs. Lucid Moments tracks his Ep3 with this exact setup.

http://www.corsportusa.com/store/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=179&products_id=5522&osCsid=26929f4acb6e63c8d74d2849f1cb12b0


A DIY oem big brake kit would be redrilled to 4x100 RSX-S rotors (there are guys who've done it on here), CRV/DC2 ITR calipers (much bigger piston for more clamping force), CRV Hawk HPS pads and SS lines.

http://incredilution.com/wp-content/gallery/Pictures/RL%20Caliper%20bracket/RSX%20Rotor.jpg
redrill RSX-S rotor like so...


Last option would be HPS pads, SS lines, and some DOT 4 fluid(which should be standard on all of these upgrades if you brake alot).I was thinking of this exact thing but he will need at least some 16's to fit over the calipers. Or will they clear the 15's?

MugenReplica
07-04-2011, 10:50 AM
Yea, he'd definitely need at least 16's...

AKEP
07-04-2011, 10:56 AM
crv>type-s calipers?

MugenReplica
07-04-2011, 11:19 AM
crv>type-s calipers?



Just a warning, go to the bathroom, grab a cold one, and have some time because there are no cliffs. This isn’t really a review or a how-to. More of a what I did, why, different option not really talked about, kind of thread..

So after 86,000 miles my brakes started squealing, time for new ones. Knowing that our cars are somewhat under braked from the factory, the front rotors are the same size as a 95 Civic SI which is around 700lbs. lighter. Along with the fact that there are some fun county roads around here and I’d like to start doing some track days next year, I decided I wanted something a bit more up to snuff..

The only problem was I had a requirement. They had to fit under the factory 15” wheel (snow tires). So that eliminated just about every big brake kit available along with a RSX-S setup (didn‘t want to buy new hubs), I have an 02, 4 lug. So after some looking around the web and asking some questions I found a solution, Fastbrakes.com 11” upgrade kit.

This size is what our car should have come with. The rotors are from a car that weights 2840*, the calipers from something weighting 3254*. Also, about the calipers’ piston area, the CR-V caliper is 111% of the stock piston area. You do not want to go over 120% of stock without using a larger master cylinder or you will have a mushy pedal. The piston size* is about 5% bigger than stock so there may be a tiny bit more pedal travel, as well as more leverage which is good.

One thing I want to say is that fastbrakes.com customer service is second to NONE, they were simply awesome. From answering my questions before I purchased my parts, to telling me the pads weren’t in stock but they would have the distributor send them directly to me, to sending my tracking number. They answered emails generally within 2 hours of me sending them, again awesome..

So my new brake set up is as follows:
Fastbrakes.com parts:
Includes Modified CR-V/accord caliper brackets
Modified 1993-1996 Prelude VTEC rotor (re-drilled to 4x100)
Everything Else:
2001 CR-V calipers
Napa replacement rear rotors
Hawk HPS front and rear pads ( F. from 2000 Type-R/ R. for EP3)
Stoptech F. & R. Stainless steel brake lines
ATE Super Blue Fluid
G2 caliper paint system-Silver (calipers and brackets)
VHT caliper paint-Black ( rotor hats)

And after all that, what everyone wants, pics:

All my new parts (already painted the rotors)
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/3263/partsbeforepaint.jpg

Front before and after
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/665/frontbefore1.jpg
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/2149/frontbefore.jpg
http://img136.imageshack.us/img136/8919/frontafter1.jpg
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/2305/frontafter.jpg
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7665/frontafter2.jpg

Rear before and after
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/4272/rearbefore.jpg
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/4910/rearafter1.jpg

Size difference
http://img187.imageshack.us/img187/1208/sizedifference.jpg

Factory wheels
http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/7732/stock1w.jpg
http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/8776/stockx.jpg

*Notes:
Prelude weight 2840
CR-V weight 3254

02 EP3 weight 2740
95 SI weight 2108

OEM caliper piston 54mm
CR-V caliper piston 57mm


^All you need to know. Last I recall from another post I can't seem to find anymore is that the ITR/CR-V caliper is a direct bolt on with the RSX-S redrilled rotor. Message Tougep3 or contact fastbrakes.com to get some more info and to add to this thread.

lbk02si
07-04-2011, 05:10 PM
You forgot to add the pads that's why lol.

haha, sorry i forgot to mention that i had hawk pads too!

lbk02si
07-04-2011, 05:14 PM
It does but way over priced.
Same performance with:
Front + Rear blank rotors $66
http://www.streetbeatcustoms.com/2003/Honda/Civic-HB/Brakes/Brake-Rotors/
If you want Axxis pads Front's $80 Rears $60
http://www.buybrakes.com/store/45-04650U
http://www.buybrakes.com/store/45-05370U
Russlle SS brake lines $90 (BTW is that Gaurdians car at the top??)
http://www.clubrsx.com/clubep3/RUS-684890.html
And i use ATE brake fluid which runs around $15

Total = ~ $315 give or take

i agree that this setup is better than that just plain stock but you can't compare new rotors/fluid/ss lines to a bbk. of course a bbk is going to be way more expense, but it also has WAY better performance as well.

02TWSI
07-04-2011, 05:25 PM
^All you need to know. Last I recall from another post I can't seem to find anymore is that the ITR/CR-V caliper is a direct bolt on with the RSX-S redrilled rotor. Message Tougep3 or contact fastbrakes.com to get some more info and to add to this thread.

Great post sir.

cyllarus
07-04-2011, 10:22 PM
Mugen replica, great post. That was actually the option i had seen a long time ago, and was searching for a few nights ago. When i could not find it i assumed i ahad been looking at a s2k site.

I'm sorry that my information is coming in bits and pieces, I'm writing this on a tablet PC.

I have 17 " SSR's so i dont belive fitment is going to be an issue with any kit. I dont have the $$ for a wild wood or other big brake kit. and the engine is too old to be tracked, so DD use is what we are looking at.

Yes, i agree that pads , lines, fluid is cheapest, and probably would suit my needs...but to be honest, im looking for a project;) and would really like to see a larger rotor behind the wheels...

so with this in lightwhats the better option? (from a braking/ez mode standpoint) re-drilled RSX-R rototors and calipers? or CRV calipers with RSXR rotors as shown in the post by touge?

Which option requires the least amount of modification?

MugenReplica
07-05-2011, 07:07 AM
Cheapest would probably be a "pseudo-DC2 Type R" swap. From what I have heard, it's similar to the Fastbrakes upgrade above (which is the other cheapest option), but uses the 10.3" stock rotor instead of an 11".....



Quoted from stuff I have saved on my laptop, but can't remember where I read it....



**** Not a true TYPE-R setup because of the rotors ****

The process is exactly as changing pads/rotors. Super simple and a quick procedure!

Parts needed:
'97 TYPE-R Calipers
'97 TYPE-R bracket
'97 TYPE-R pads
'93 LS rotors (need to compare to stock Ep3 rotor)
Brake Fluid
Beer

Caliper brackets need to be machined 3.2mm or .127in. (NOT sure if this step is necessary, CHECK FIRST then machine IF needed!!!)
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/1342/dsc03537s.jpg


10.3" LS rotor vs. a 9.5" EF rotor
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/6606/dsc03536j.jpg


EF pad vs. DC2 ITR pad
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/3492/dsc03538jwa.jpg


You may OR may NOT need to grind front pad to clear rotor hat.
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/6765/dsc03540o.jpg


Comparison of smaller EF calipers vs. DC2 ITR calipers...
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/6986/dsc03543lph.jpg


Finished Setup...
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/4639/dsc03542scx.jpg
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/9745/dsc03544w.jpg

Fits easily under a 15" wheel with plenty of clearance. The upgrade should equate to a firmer pedal feel but with a little longer pedal movement before engagement due to the larger caliper piston.




Here is the list of cars that all use the DC2 ITR brake pads so they MAY be using the DC2 ITR calipers but not 100% positive on all of them.......


1997 - 1999 CL
1991 - 2005 NSX
1997 - 1998 Integra
1996 - 1998 RL
2000 - 2001 Integra
1995 - 1998 TL
1991 - 1995 Legend
1992 - 1994 Vigor

1991 - 2002 Accord (Wagon specific)
1995 - 1998 Odyssey
1997 - 2001 CR-V
1993 - 2001 Prelude

1996 - 1999 Oasis

27rocks
07-05-2011, 07:27 AM
When i had my little 93 VX it had those tiny little 9.5 rotors with drums in the rear. It would always get so hot on hard drives and would end up leaving me without brakes at the end of the corner lol. Sooooo i ended up buying a complete GSR set up and man did it make a huge difference. Not only were the fronts bigger but i had rear discs. After the swap i was never able to get them hot enough to the point where it started fading no matter how hard i tried, so it was well worth the time and $$ to swap.

cyllarus
07-05-2011, 08:03 PM
Hrm.

From FastBrakes:
2001-2005 Civic 4 bolt 11" slotted/drilled kit

List Price: $680.00
Our Price: $680.00
Sale Price: $680.00

Complete Fastbrakes 11" front upgrade kit for the 4 bolt EP Civic, including Si. Kit includes the remanufactured TypeR/CR-V calipers with modified brackets, slotted/drilled 11" rotors, performance brake pads, and front braided steel brake lines.

---

For that price i'd rather just get the 4 pot 12.2 wildwood kit that i see advertised on the same site.

Based on all the posts i think the option i want to go with is the RSX-s setup, with the re-drilled rotors

Correct me if I'm wrong but all I would need to get is:
rsx-s rotors drilled to 4x100 bolt pattern.
rsx-s Calipers / brackets
rsx-s performance pads
SS lines
fluid

Basic stock + 1 upgrade correct?

Lucid Moments
07-05-2011, 09:28 PM
I'm going to throw my opinion in the mix.

For a DD all you need is new pads, SS lines, and stock replacement rotors. Yes I have the 12.2" Wilwood kit (its actually only 12.19" btw) and am mostly very happy with it. I never have problems with fade and that is on one track that is notoriously brutal on brakes. But you aren't tracking your car so that doesn't matter.


Here is where I get annoying on the subject of brakes. Some people will believe this some people won't.

BIG BRAKES WON'T STOP YOUR CAR ANY FASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BRAKES DON'T STOP YOUR CAR TIRES DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you can hit your brakes and your ABS activates then you are stopping as fast as it is possible for you to stop with the tires you are using. You should be able to do that several times in a row from any speed before you overwhelm your stock brakes. If you upgrade your pads and fluid then you should be able to do that more often. The limiting factor is heat. The main thing a big brake kit offers is a larger heat sink. All it lets you do is do that even more often without waiting on your brakes to cool down.

A good brake kit will also give a little better feedback due to better design, or weigh less, but those are secondary.

So at the end of the day pick up some stainless steel lines, flush your fluid with some good fluid (I use ATE Super Blue) and put some good pads on there (Hawk HPS or EBC Green, or Carbotech Bobcat) and call it done.

Lucid Moments
07-05-2011, 09:34 PM
I have to say this again because some people won't get it.

BIG BRAKES WON'T STOP YOUR CAR ANY FASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BRAKES DON'T STOP YOUR CAR TIRES DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

27rocks
07-05-2011, 09:48 PM
I'm going to throw my opinion in the mix.

For a DD all you need is new pads, SS lines, and stock replacement rotors. Yes I have the 12.2" Wilwood kit (its actually only 12.19" btw) and am mostly very happy with it. I never have problems with fade and that is on one track that is notoriously brutal on brakes. But you aren't tracking your car so that doesn't matter.


Here is where I get annoying on the subject of brakes. Some people will believe this some people won't.

BIG BRAKES WON'T STOP YOUR CAR ANY FASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!
BRAKES DON'T STOP YOUR CAR TIRES DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If you can hit your brakes and your ABS activates then you are stopping as fast as it is possible for you to stop with the tires you are using. You should be able to do that several times in a row from any speed before you overwhelm your stock brakes. If you upgrade your pads and fluid then you should be able to do that more often. The limiting factor is heat. The main thing a big brake kit offers is a larger heat sink. All it lets you do is do that even more often without waiting on your brakes to cool down.

A good brake kit will also give a little better feedback due to better design, or weigh less, but those are secondary.

So at the end of the day pick up some stainless steel lines, flush your fluid with some good fluid (I use ATE Super Blue) and put some good pads on there (Hawk HPS or EBC Green, or Carbotech Bobcat) and call it done.I agree which is why i already posted links to parts to upgrade everything listed above.


Hrm.

Based on all the posts i think the option i want to go with is the RSX-s setup, with the re-drilled rotors

Correct me if I'm wrong but all I would need to get is:
rsx-s rotors drilled to 4x100 bolt pattern.
rsx-s Calipers / brackets
rsx-s performance pads
SS lines
fluid

Basic stock + 1 upgrade correct? Correct, however you might need 16'' wheels or larger to fit over the calipers. BTW the calipers and brackets are all in one piece.

cyllarus
07-06-2011, 09:04 PM
Lucid. Point taken. What im after is a slightly upgraded pedal feel, and a bit more bite. im not expecting something drastic.

Rocks,What im askng about is the bracket that the pads slide into. If you look at the few pics of rxs-s calipers posted for sale on ebay, youll see that the rsx certainly does have a caliper bracket that the pads slide into, and the caliper mounts to, much like the ep3.

if i buy the caliper bracket that the rsx uses, i assume that this will bolt directly onto the hub, and align with the rotor corectly.

Lucid Moments
07-07-2011, 04:23 AM
Lucid. Point taken. What im after is a slightly upgraded pedal feel, and a bit more bite. im not expecting something drastic.

That being the case then Stainless lines and better pads should give you what you want.

Don't get me wrong. I certainly have nothing against going with a bigger rotor and caliper, but when you are on a budget why spend money on something that won't do you any good?

Siborg
07-07-2011, 06:58 AM
I have some Rotora for sale if your interested in a good bbk....
http://www.ephatch.com/forum/showthread.php?61666-FS-HFP-Wing-Rotora-Brake-Kit-OEM-Seat-BeltsDelete

15000rpms
07-07-2011, 02:32 PM
Ok here's my advise. Since you're on a budget and want to keep your current wheels you only have one good option. But before we get to that i want to throw some things out there...

As far as the Willwood kit goes i would pass on it (don't really need them). The only thing that's appealing about it is the fact you get 4 piston calipers and that's it. The rotors are still small in comparison to stock. If you buy a BBK you buy it because you are having heat issues under hard braking so you want something with more material to dissipate that heat and cool faster. Well you cant really do that with something pretty much the same size if you are already having issues to begin with on the stock set.
The second option which i think is by far the best not only for performance but also for the amount of $$. New good aggressive pads, ss lines and top notch fluid will up the temps on your brakes before they start getting to hot and give you good solid bite. I would also skip on drilled or slotted rotors. We're on a budget here and that's one thing you honestly don't need and can save a pretty penny on. Cheap blanks will be plenty good and they will work pretty much identically as any other name brand slotted/drilled rotor out there.

Now if you still run into temp issues at the end of long straights i would honestly look into making some kind of ventilation to the front brakes. All you need is two brake ducts from the front bumper which should keep the temps way down.
http://image.musclemustangfastfords.com/f/8867567/mmfp_0707_08_z+2007_steeda_Q335_mustang+brake_cool ing_ducts.jpg

does this interfere with anything? Thanks for the pics; it was gonna take me forever to get under the car and find a way to do this. So this just cools the inside?

27rocks
07-08-2011, 07:31 AM
does this interfere with anything? Thanks for the pics; it was gonna take me forever to get under the car and find a way to do this. So this just cools the inside?If you do it correctly it shouldn't. It cools the brake rotors.

cyllarus
07-10-2011, 12:50 PM
Looks like I'm going to go with the re-drilled RSX rotors and RSX calipers. Is there an online shop that sells the rotors re-drilled? A reputable one that we have some experience with and can vouch for?

Or do i just need to buy whatever rotors from ebay.. or where ever, and take them to a local machine shop to have them re-drilled?

hyu
07-10-2011, 02:45 PM
Drilled rotors have a tendency to shatter since it alters the structural integrity of the rotors

"Vehicles that have holes in their rotors from the factory also have large, heavy rotors and the same in wheels. The holes are there to reduce unsprung weight. They are not there to reduce temperatures (that's what bi- or uni-directional vanes are for) or reduce out-gassing (modern-day pad material produces little or no gas).

Compare two rotors of the same diameter and thickness, one with holes and one without, and the one with holes will actually run hotter.

If you must have the bling (holes), you must increase the diameter and thickness of the rotor. And that means the existing calipers and wheels at the very least have to go as well, since a larger rotor won't fit. A better solution, if you have to have something other than factory-type rotors, is slots."

http://www.allfordmustangs.com/forums/5-0l-talk/51998-drilled-slotted-rotors.html

cyllarus
07-10-2011, 07:56 PM
Hrm, thought i replied to this.. but i guess it went nowhere.

The re-drilling I'm talking about here is redriling the central "hat" or whatever you like to call it from the whatever the 5-lug RSX patern is to the 4x100 EP3 bolt pattern.

I'm not considering getting crosdrilled rotors. If i want any "bling" i will go with slotted rotors.

Anyone know a good source for RSX rotors re-drilled to the ep3 4x100 patern, thats not a huge mark up? What about buying the cheap RSX blanks at napa or whereever and having a machine shop drill them, anyone done that before?

iDom
07-26-2011, 06:37 AM
Lots of good info in here. I too would like a brake upgrade.. But it's best to be sensible about it.

I think looking at anything beyond SS lines, fluid, pads is a pure WASTE if it's a DD and you're only 'thinking' about taking it to a track or autoX.. Also, even IF you are FOR SURE going to track the car, you would have to literally have the brakes be the limiting factor in your track times for a BBK to actually be useful.. Chances are, if you are only now looking in to braking upgrades, it will take you a long time to use your car to its full potential AS IS.

Also, like the few other people have said.. TIRES!! You can have the fastest and best handling and best braking car in the world but if you can't put it to the ground, it means nothing. Ask anyone, tires is a more important upgrade than suspension, brakes, sway bars, etc..

da9b16
11-28-2011, 10:40 PM
I can tell this is an old thread so whatever to waking the dead. Just thought you all would like to see my 11" big brake kit for less than 100 that I have installed.

First off- DO YOUR HOMEWORK- DO NOT SKIMP OUT ON ANYTHING... THIS IS BRAKES we are doing here. They CAN be done for on the cheap but make 100% certain you KNOW what the he77 you are doing.

parts list I used:

99 acura CL 3.0 calipers with 25t brackets(cost was 33 total at Pick n Pull and there is a 6 dollar core that I could get back so technically they were 27 including the brackets!) NOT THE 23T or the 28T.... these are the same as a lot of other model honda's and acura's that utilize an
11" rotor. Do your homework on leading and trailing brakes. I won't go into details here. AGAIN you NEED the 25T brackets...

2007 mini cooper DOHC 280mm rotors-($42 shipped for the pair NEW)There are 3 different rotor sizes available... 276mm, 280mm (11" actually = 279.4mm.... CLOSE ENOUGH), the last is a 294mm.... The 276 and 280mm are BOTH available in 4x100 and come with the same size center bore (64mm I think)

Pads-(warrantied out pads from my wagons=free so roughly 30 for some pads) take your pick...don't depend on me for your answers or my opinions on what is best for pads.... I can tell the difference in some but not so much in others.

I already had brake fluid but maybe an additional cost of 2-5 depending on brands.

Now on to the comparison and install pix.


In this picture you can see the OLDER rotor is the 02 ep3 rotor and caliper bracket sitting next to their BIGGER BEEFIER BROTHERS from the CL and the mini cooper.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_120227.jpg

Installed- yeah I know there is a mark on the rotor. I did not take my time cleaning as I should have when bleeding and got a groove I took it off and machined it out. OH WELL....
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_125235.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_122836.jpg

I had the flu this weekend when I installed them and still did it all in under an hour and drove them around testing them out. I have driven over 300 miles and brakes stop on a dime now... They are VERY sensitive compared to the weak ep brakes.

Just thought I would share my experience in brakes. If you need help let me know.

PatrickJamesYu
11-28-2011, 11:29 PM
@da9b16 nice write up.
And it's 56.1mm fr the bore
the 64 is the 5lug ep3.

sleepy ep3
11-28-2011, 11:40 PM
People also forget that the BBK kits also weigh less. The center section is normally made from aluminum, and the calipers are lighter as well. I see so many people on here going with really expensive wheels trying to save "unsprung weight" and then rocking the stock brake setup. I bought the Wilwood BBK, and love it. It looks sexy, saves weight, and brakes well. It's not really all that expensive when you just buy it and install it, rather than doing tons of research, running to a bunch of junkyards and parts stores piecing together a "custom" oem kit, but then again, I don't know what anyone's time is worth either.

hyu
11-29-2011, 01:06 AM
@da9b16 hmm def interested in that write up. Is it possible to post up pictures of how the rim sits over the rotors?

PatrickJamesYu
11-29-2011, 02:49 AM
@da9b16 hmm def interested in that write up. Is it possible to post up pictures of how the rim sits over the rotors?

THE rim? or A rim?

da9b16
11-30-2011, 12:28 PM
People also forget that the BBK kits also weigh less. The center section is normally made from aluminum, and the calipers are lighter as well. I see so many people on here going with really expensive wheels trying to save "unsprung weight" and then rocking the stock brake setup. I bought the Wilwood BBK, and love it. It looks sexy, saves weight, and brakes well. It's not really all that expensive when you just buy it and install it, rather than doing tons of research, running to a bunch of junkyards and parts stores piecing together a "custom" oem kit, but then again, I don't know what anyone's time is worth either.

I cant afford a 600-1000 brake kit. I am a baller on a budget. I did all of that for under 100. I did the research and my time is worth a lot. So making my dollar stretch and produce the most is more important to me than spending more money. Oh and I guess if you included my research time I would say all of 2 hrs including buying rotors on ebay. Then 45 min drive time and pickup of calipers at the junkyard. I make 70k a year..... but that is for my family to live on and other personal things. So living smarter and shopping wiser is what I do. I don't buy ANYTHING if its not on sale. And I am so anal about things if I miss the previews at a dollar movie...I will get a refund.... LOL. By the way I am an analyst not an english major. I don't care about proper sentence structure on most days as well.



Of course is if you are into the bling factor you could go for the big names like Brembo or Willwood etc. Or you could look harder for the legend dual piston calipers or NSX calipers and be in the same boat.

da9b16
11-30-2011, 12:31 PM
@da9b16 hmm def interested in that write up. Is it possible to post up pictures of how the rim sits over the rotors?

Pix coming up..

before:
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/IMAG0531.jpg

after
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111130_082812.jpg

Kind of hard to see from the angles.... but you can see the major difference looking at the spacing between the edge of caliper and inside lip of wheel. Oh yeah and you can see the caliper where I had to shave the bracket to make the wheel fit.
Sorry for the pix if they are too big I can resize?

cyllarus
12-06-2011, 04:02 PM
Interesting that this thread has come back up.

DBA thats a nice write up, and pretty good looking brakes. Id be interested to know what the pedal feedback is like.

For myself I ended up buying SiBorgs Rotara brake kit for ~550. A bit much when compared to what DBA did, but very cheap considering what I got.

for a DD the rotaras are massive overkill, but not wasted completely. You'd be surprised how much faster you are willing to drive when your braking pedal feel is solid and you get good feedback. For 500 i completely changed one of the 3 main characteristics of the car ( Acel / cornering / braking)

I wish the other 2 aspects were as easy / cheap to bring up to the same level as the brakes.

overall the 500 I spent on the rotara's is the best 500 i've ever spent on my car.

now my limiting factor as far as braking is tires, and how fast the person behind me can stop.. :)

MugenReplica
12-06-2011, 05:40 PM
I can tell this is an old thread so whatever to waking the dead. Just thought you all would like to see my 11" big brake kit for less than 100 that I have installed.

First off- DO YOUR HOMEWORK- DO NOT SKIMP OUT ON ANYTHING... THIS IS BRAKES we are doing here. They CAN be done for on the cheap but make 100% certain you KNOW what the he77 you are doing.

parts list I used:

99 acura CL 3.0 calipers with 25t brackets(cost was 33 total at Pick n Pull and there is a 6 dollar core that I could get back so technically they were 27 including the brackets!) NOT THE 23T or the 28T.... these are the same as a lot of other model honda's and acura's that utilize an
11" rotor. Do your homework on leading and trailing brakes. I won't go into details here. AGAIN you NEED the 25T brackets...

2007 mini cooper DOHC 280mm rotors-($42 shipped for the pair NEW)There are 3 different rotor sizes available... 276mm, 280mm (11" actually = 279.4mm.... CLOSE ENOUGH), the last is a 294mm.... The 276 and 280mm are BOTH available in 4x100 and come with the same size center bore (64mm I think)

Pads-(warrantied out pads from my wagons=free so roughly 30 for some pads) take your pick...don't depend on me for your answers or my opinions on what is best for pads.... I can tell the difference in some but not so much in others.

I already had brake fluid but maybe an additional cost of 2-5 depending on brands.

Now on to the comparison and install pix.


In this picture you can see the OLDER rotor is the 02 ep3 rotor and caliper bracket sitting next to their BIGGER BEEFIER BROTHERS from the CL and the mini cooper.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_120227.jpg

Installed- yeah I know there is a mark on the rotor. I did not take my time cleaning as I should have when bleeding and got a groove I took it off and machined it out. OH WELL....
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_125235.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_122836.jpg

I had the flu this weekend when I installed them and still did it all in under an hour and drove them around testing them out. I have driven over 300 miles and brakes stop on a dime now... They are VERY sensitive compared to the weak ep brakes.

Just thought I would share my experience in brakes. If you need help let me know.

Any chance you'd be willing to write up a DIY for this?

StockTexasEP3
12-06-2011, 10:33 PM
I can tell this is an old thread so whatever to waking the dead. Just thought you all would like to see my 11" big brake kit for less than 100 that I have installed.

First off- DO YOUR HOMEWORK- DO NOT SKIMP OUT ON ANYTHING... THIS IS BRAKES we are doing here. They CAN be done for on the cheap but make 100% certain you KNOW what the he77 you are doing.

parts list I used:

99 acura CL 3.0 calipers with 25t brackets(cost was 33 total at Pick n Pull and there is a 6 dollar core that I could get back so technically they were 27 including the brackets!) NOT THE 23T or the 28T.... these are the same as a lot of other model honda's and acura's that utilize an
11" rotor. Do your homework on leading and trailing brakes. I won't go into details here. AGAIN you NEED the 25T brackets...

2007 mini cooper DOHC 280mm rotors-($42 shipped for the pair NEW)There are 3 different rotor sizes available... 276mm, 280mm (11" actually = 279.4mm.... CLOSE ENOUGH), the last is a 294mm.... The 276 and 280mm are BOTH available in 4x100 and come with the same size center bore (64mm I think)

Pads-(warrantied out pads from my wagons=free so roughly 30 for some pads) take your pick...don't depend on me for your answers or my opinions on what is best for pads.... I can tell the difference in some but not so much in others.

I already had brake fluid but maybe an additional cost of 2-5 depending on brands.

Now on to the comparison and install pix.


In this picture you can see the OLDER rotor is the 02 ep3 rotor and caliper bracket sitting next to their BIGGER BEEFIER BROTHERS from the CL and the mini cooper.
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_120227.jpg

Installed- yeah I know there is a mark on the rotor. I did not take my time cleaning as I should have when bleeding and got a groove I took it off and machined it out. OH WELL....
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_125235.jpg
http://i48.photobucket.com/albums/f227/da9b16/20111126_122836.jpg

I had the flu this weekend when I installed them and still did it all in under an hour and drove them around testing them out. I have driven over 300 miles and brakes stop on a dime now... They are VERY sensitive compared to the weak ep brakes.

Just thought I would share my experience in brakes. If you need help let me know.

Nice! Did you get the rotors from a junkyard? What is pick and pull. I would like to do what you did but I'm a super noob and am confused how to get all these different parts. Halp!

Bradk20
12-08-2011, 05:41 AM
Im curios if anyone has any suggestions of upgrading brakes on an 03 model 4 lug with oem wheels. i currently have brembo blanks and hawk hps pads. had em for about 6 month or so now but all it took was a full hard brakes from over a 100 and they were warped yet again.

im guessing there is not much i can do other than mb get better fluid and stop braking hard at high speeds till i can get some wheels and bigger brakes. any other suggestions would be great though.

StockTexasEP3
12-08-2011, 10:41 PM
Bump for help on the budget 4 lug upgrade!

PatrickJamesYu
12-09-2011, 01:22 AM
Nice! Did you get the rotors from a junkyard? What is pick and pull. I would like to do what you did but I'm a super noob and am confused how to get all these different parts. Halp!

Pick and Pull is essentially a junk yard
Pick a Part, Pick n Pull, etc.

cyllarus
12-15-2011, 03:36 PM
@BradK20.

The fact that hard stops from highway speeds would results in brake wobble after just a couple of stops is exactly what prompted me to start looking for brake upgrades in the first place.

Without changing your wheels, your options are pretty limited. Even then basic +1 upgrade of RSX calipers and rotors requires 16 inch rims. However, as I said before, upgrading the brakes on these cars should be the first thing we do after rims/tires.

Zzyzx
12-16-2011, 03:00 PM
Im curios if anyone has any suggestions of upgrading brakes on an 03 model 4 lug with oem wheels. i currently have brembo blanks and hawk hps pads. had em for about 6 month or so now but all it took was a full hard brakes from over a 100 and they were warped yet again.

im guessing there is not much i can do other than mb get better fluid and stop braking hard at high speeds till i can get some wheels and bigger brakes. any other suggestions would be great though.

Change pads to ones with higher temp resistance and bed the pads properly.

incidentally, rotors don't warp. That pulsing that you are feeling is an uneven layer of brake pad transfer meterial on the rotors surface. It can happen when you push a brake pad past its normal opperating temps as well as if you get the brakes hot and then come to a complete stop.

to fix the problem now you can try two things. 1st would be to re bed the pads, the bedding process can sometimes wear off those high spots and save the rotor. Else you can have the rotor turned and then wait to see if the pulsing comes back.



@BradK20.

The fact that hard stops from highway speeds would results in brake wobble after just a couple of stops is exactly what prompted me to start looking for brake upgrades in the first place.

Without changing your wheels, your options are pretty limited. Even then basic +1 upgrade of RSX calipers and rotors requires 16 inch rims. However, as I said before, upgrading the brakes on these cars should be the first thing we do after rims/tires.


Getting that pulsing feeling after a few stops screams that you are using the wrong brake pad for your needs.

hyu
03-13-2012, 09:41 PM
Reason why I want to do a rotor/brake swap. This is from the rears on one week old rotor =/
http://sphotos.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/p480x480/428294_10150712939632959_502932958_11353946_166741 2653_n.jpg
Also obviously our front rotor/caliper is bigger than our rear... Which would be more efficient? Swapping my front rear caliper/rotor to my rear feasible or using the diy or buying new all around?