SoHonda Garage official OEM intake test

[SHG_EasyE]

So to put a long standing curiosity of mine to rest SHG_Mike and I did some intake testing on my car last week. I picked up a MINT stock airbox setup a few days before so we could test the stock airbox vs. the Hondata mod airbox vs. my SHG/Hondata mod airbox. Otherwise stock engine other than Buddy Club spec 3 exhaust and RSX-S manifold and cat.

Stock (not my image)

http://www.civictyper.de/bilder/tuning_airintake/CTR_EP3_Hondata_Airbox_Mod_01.jpg

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Heres the Hondata mod which is basically a gutted bottom half (not my image)

http://www.civictyper.de/bilder/tuning_airintake/CTR_EP3_Hondata_Mod_02.jpg

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And my own Iteration which is a Hondata mod with reliefs cut in the lower panels to experiment with more direct air flow.

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090826-1.jpg

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Had the scan tool up for live data to make sure coolant temp and air intake temp were the same for each pull.

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090827-1.jpg

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The results speak for themselves... Stock box made massive torque over both modded units and gained a little horsepower over the whole curve. It was a hot muggy day so the numbers we saw are not comparable to my baseline run when it was 65 deg and dry.

Ambient temp - 95*
Humidity - 66%
IAT before each pull - 114*
ECT before each pull - 187*

Dotted green line - Stock
Dashed green line- Hondata mod
Yellow line - SHG/Hondata mod

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/SHG_AirboxTest.jpg

[gamma6]

Nice, so leave it stock then huh?

[MadLorEP3]

tnx for doing this bro...saw this on honda-tech as well...thats really good to know
so there is no doing the hondata mod lol...

[SHG_EasyE]

Nice, so leave it stock then huh?

Yup... Honda spent millions in R+D for a reason :)

On that note this is my new setup...

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090869.jpg

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090870.jpg

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090868.jpg

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t131/sohonda_garage/P1090867.jpg

[T_Virus]

good info...

[PAPITUYO326]

Did you tune your setup with each box or did you just drop it in and compare off the stock map? Wouldn't surprise me to see the OEM unit lose it's lead when the car is tuned for the modded units, specially on more demanding motors (a2 head equipped) that benefit from having a freer flowing intake system.

[SHG_EasyE]

Did you tune your setup with each box or did you just drop it in and compare off the stock map? Wouldn't surprise me to see the OEM unit lose it's lead when the car is tuned for the modded units, specially on more demanding motors (a2 head equipped) that benefit from having a freer flowing intake system.

No I am running stock ECU. This test is for those that are untuned and otherwise stock (with exhaust). If you have the ability to tune its a totally different story.

Although even stock with the ability to tune, Im not sure there is much you could do with a tune to improve with a different air box. AFR was FLAT across the board at between 12.5 and 13 and was identical with every pull between all intakes.

[ep3steez]

:meek: wow... good info

[PAPITUYO326]

No I am running stock ECU. This test is for those that are untuned and otherwise stock (with exhaust). If you have the ability to tune its a totally different story.

Although even stock with the ability to tune, Im not sure there is much you could do with a tune to improve with a different air box. AFR was FLAT across the board at between 12.5 and 13 and was identical with every pull between all intakes.

Yep, the bolded part is pretty much what I was getting at. Half the people who posted seemed to think the Hondata mod is now useless, when in fact it has been proven to make power. The only requirement is that your engine needs to be strong enough on the exit end to warrant the modification on the inlet.

Either way, nice test. It'll probably keep the modification-restricted auto-x crowd from ripping their OEM boxes. :mbiggrin:

[SHG_EasyE]

Yep, the bolded part is pretty much what I was getting at. Half the people who posted seemed to think the Hondata mod is now useless, when in fact it has been proven to make power. The only requirement is that your engine needs to be strong enough on the exit end to warrant the modification on the inlet.

Either way, nice test. It'll probably keep the modification-restricted auto-x crowd from ripping their OEM boxes. :mbiggrin:

I still dont buy that Hondata mod makes power on a stock engine, even an engine with exhaust. (I have a buddy club spec 3 with stock RSX-S manifold and cat). Until I see a test with identical IAT and ECT numbers for each pull, back to back test under the same conditions etc I wont preach it. Plus, from what Ive seen, most people either dont know how, or ignore the proper way to operate a dynapack to show "gains" where there are none.

I can see possible gains with a race header and tune, but anything less than that I think OEM is the way to go.

[powdbyrice]

The gains aren't worth the effort that it takes to cut up the box. I cut off all the fins in the box too. So. Not. Worth. It.

[PAPITUYO326]

They have nothing to gain from publishing their results all those years ago, it's not like they sold their modification services. :shrug: Their tests were done with the a2 engine, which responds much better to modifications. It is sucking air from essentially the same straw as the A3 all the while revving higher and with more aggressive cam/rocker system.

I'm not disagreeing with your premise that the OEM box outperforms the gutted box on a stockish A3, you just proved it lol. I am just pointing out that it is not an all-in-one solution, specially on swapped EPs or cars with added hardware on the exhaust end.

[SHG_EasyE]

Yeah I completely agree with you aswell. Race header + tune A3, A2, etc are a different story.

Not saying Hondata fabricated results either, but this is very good information for anyone to know thats shopping for power adding modifications...

If youre looking at dyno results or comparisons done on a Dynapack its absolutely imperative you find out whether the test was done with the dyno's coolant system on or off. The way they work (produce resistance and apply load) is by shearing hydraulic fluid. When you do back to back runs, even just 2 or 3, that fluid heats up and gets thinner, thus less resistance and it will appear the engine is making more power. The coolant system needs to be turned on from the very start, and a few pulls need to be made to get the dyno up to operating temp. We have modded our dynapack with an external fluid temp sensor aswell to roughly monitor the fluid viscosity.

Just to put this into perspective, we had our S2000 race car dynod at Jeff Evans tuning last year on the way to VIR for a race (it was last minute) and he was NOT running the coolant system. Every pull made more power even if he was not making changes. Ive heard the same from multiple people who have gotten tuned by him, they just thought he was doing a great job tuning the car. The results are basically a lie. Not to say his tunes are no good, but his final numbers are definitely not accurate with that system.

[AKEP]

where did you get that wrap from?

[apexracing]

good info but the stock air box takes up too much room.

[Jukka]

I wonder if running a setup like mine would make any sort of difference...
http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff213/6GCCanada/interiortegiwa013.jpg
I wrapped my entire box in that DEI heat wrap, silicone intake hose, fed with a flexable hose routed down to my wheel well and the traditional Hondata airbox mod and K&N filter.

[TheKone]

So in your opinion SHG, how would a simple short ram intake like the AEM or Injen compare to a bone stock airbox?

[WPB EP3]

Did you tune your setup with each box or did you just drop it in and compare off the stock map? Wouldn't surprise me to see the OEM unit lose it's lead when the car is tuned for the modded units, specially on more demanding motors (a2 head equipped) that benefit from having a freer flowing intake system.

This is very true. Had all three comparisons been tuned, you'd surely have different results.

[SHG_EasyE]

good info but the stock air box takes up too much room.

Too much room? what else would you put there?


I wonder if running a setup like mine would make any sort of difference...
http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/ff213/6GCCanada/interiortegiwa013.jpg
I wrapped my entire box in that DEI heat wrap, silicone intake hose, fed with a flexable hose routed down to my wheel well and the traditional Hondata airbox mod and K&N filter.

Heat tape and cold air retreived from the wheel well for sure would lower intake air temps - denser air = more power. Nice setup you have there.


So in your opinion SHG, how would a simple short ram intake like the AEM or Injen compare to a bone stock airbox?

Cant say for sure since I didnt test it, but on an ITR we tuned a little while back a short ram with velocity stack lost HP and torque compared to stock airbox. Cant say if the results would be the same on our cars.


This is very true. Had all three comparisons been tuned, you'd surely have different results.

I wouldnt be so sure. You can only make gains if you can make use of the extra air (if any) youre getting into the engine. The engine may not be able to make use of more air or different resonance frequencies when using a stock manifold and cat, even with a tune.

For example, we do alot of work with miatas, and even with the ability to tune the car (haltech standalone) intakes make no power, And you only pick up 5-7 max between a full intake/race header exhaust. This is because the intake manifold, ports, and cams are designed so poorly that the capabilities of the head to flow air are just about maxed out with stock plumbing.

I will be doing a second installment of this test on my A2 when it goes in (eventually) with Kpro, and attempt to maximise the tune for each intake and see what the result is.

Keep in mind the whole point of this test was to compare the different airboxes on a STOCK engine, for those who dont have the luxury of tuning, and are trying to make simple cheap bolt on power. Ive seen ALOT of guys with stock ECU A3's and Hondata mods, this test was to clear the air of what option yeilds better results.