Twin Scroll Turbo Setup

[playap07]

Sup Ephatch members. Hey is anyone running a full twin scroll turbo set up in their ep? By that i mean a twinscroll manifold and a twinscroll turbo? If so what is your input on this?

The reason im asking this is because im thinking about doing a twin scroll turbo setup when I get my k24a1. Why do i want to do this?

I would like to do this because im thinking with the use of a 2.4L engine will build boost quicker than that of a 2.0L with the use of a 50trim turbo or bigger. So if i get a twin scroll turbo that build boost even quicker than a non twin scroll one im wondering if i would be able to build boost on say a 50 trim turbo around 2-3k and reach full boost at maybe 3800k and have a steady stream of power up to 6500k. Im just coming up with a game plan right now so i would like to hear some opinions/facts on this issue.

[AKEP]

you and me man, andre has a sidewinder twinscroll jig, ep specific sitting on the bench right now. if you go 30r twinscroll you'll hit boost like me man.

or ctd's manifold (i think he said its twinscroll capable) next best thing.

how you not going to ask me about this in person? whats up with that?!

[Ctd-fab]

I heart Twinscroll!!!:mcool: Makes manifolds a challenge


It depends on your goals but if you looking for something to spool very quickly the 30r would work. Make sure to use a good size exhaust housing, I recommend something like a 1.06 T4.

K24's even spool up open 35r sized turbos pretty easily. A forum member on here, Andy, had some great results and he was at 200tq at 2500rpm!

I am working on a K series topmount that utilizes a stock Evo X twinscroll turbo. Sized for massive torque and about 350hp with insane spool up time and OEM reliability. Also internally gated which saves at least $500 on buying two external gates.

I make twinscroll evo turbo manifolds for quite a few engines, Honda D/B/K and Nissan SR20. They are perfect for someone on a budget that wants real, responsive street power. Interesting enough, the Evo X engine is the same bore and stroke as a K20. Here is a stock evo X turbo dyno with bolt ons. Notice the powerband, that = fun. Plus with the option of bolting all the way up to a Garrett stock replacement dbb 35R GTX.

http://www.mkcperformance.com/wp-content/gallery/dyno-graphs/donovan-b-2010-evo-x-dyno-graph-perrin-cbe-works-panel-filter-boost-pill-removed-25psi.jpg



I would like to think our K's flow a bit better and without the AWD drivetrain loss, numbers would be higher. A low miles good condition Evo X turbo is going to run $4-500 which is a bit cheaper than my cost on a 50-57 trim. With a little dyno time and some Exhaust manifold back pressure logging I would be able to tell if a minor turbine wheel clip would needed to preserve top end.


Your pocket book is going to hurt with a 30r and dual gates, something like a $1800-2000 dent.

Have you looked into SPL Quick Spool valves?

[AKEP]

i havent. thats dope but i don't think it will fit. k24 clearance is a premium.

[Ctd-fab]

It does add about 3/4 inch but has worked wonders with big single turbo supra guys.

I know I could do a slight redesign on mine to drop the collector 3/4". A configuration with a T3 divided 1.06 30 or 35r with a quick spool valve and open manifold with a single gate would be very interesting to see. The cost of the quick spool valve is however a bit more than a second gate.

Tried and true is a sidewinder though. I would go that route if you have the cash, its an easy choice.

[Ctd-fab]

Thinking about it now, ATP sells divided housings for a t3/t4 stage three wheel with a 0.78 and 1.06 A/R. Using a journal bearing 57trim 450hp would be possible with great response and under $800 brand new with the 0.78 A/R. Looks like the 1.06 is available but at about $400 by itself. A 57 trim is larger than a 30r but less efficient, almost half price though.

http://www.atpturbo.com/mm5/graphics/00000001/Catalog%20Images/Turbochargers/divided_t3.jpg

[AKEP]

if i find a new career path sometime soon, i may. now that i have a jig just sitting at the shop its kinda up in the air with what i want. i'd still rather have a top mount, i'd just have to slice up my down pipe and reweld it. and get a new wg either way. like you have been saying your set up seems much more proper. i feel like sidewinders are a fad or something.

im talking like im buying one tomorrow, lol. this is next season stuff. playap though, hes in the market. he needs to hurry up and order that 6 puck clutch!

[playap07]

if i find a new career path sometime soon, i may. now that i have a jig just sitting at the shop its kinda up in the air with what i want. i'd still rather have a top mount, i'd just have to slice up my down pipe and reweld it. and get a new wg either way. like you have been saying your set up seems much more proper. i feel like sidewinders are a fad or something.

im talking like im buying one tomorrow, lol. this is next season stuff. playap though, hes in the market. he needs to hurry up and order that 6 puck clutch!

Haha yea brudah! thats what im doing now. the clutch is pissing me off so if i replace the clutch im replacing the engine and run a new better setup. so now im doing some research on if i can run this twinscroll in her. Beast mode! I cant let my #1 ep3 rivial AKEP whoop my ass hp wise hahaha! im thinking about starting this in January if the clutch can hold on a lil bit longer.




I heart Twinscroll!!!:mcool: Makes manifolds a challenge


It depends on your goals but if you looking for something to spool very quickly the 30r would work. Make sure to use a good size exhaust housing, I recommend something like a 1.06 T4.

K24's even spool up open 35r sized turbos pretty easily. A forum member on here, Andy, had some great results and he was at 200tq at 2500rpm!

I am working on a K series topmount that utilizes a stock Evo X twinscroll turbo. Sized for massive torque and about 350hp with insane spool up time and OEM reliability. Also internally gated which saves at least $500 on buying two external gates.

I make twinscroll evo turbo manifolds for quite a few engines, Honda D/B/K and Nissan SR20. They are perfect for someone on a budget that wants real, responsive street power. Interesting enough, the Evo X engine is the same bore and stroke as a K20. Here is a stock evo X turbo dyno with bolt ons. Notice the powerband, that = fun. Plus with the option of bolting all the way up to a Garrett stock replacement dbb 35R GTX.



I would like to think our K's flow a bit better and without the AWD drivetrain loss, numbers would be higher. A low miles good condition Evo X turbo is going to run $4-500 which is a bit cheaper than my cost on a 50-57 trim. With a little dyno time and some Exhaust manifold back pressure logging I would be able to tell if a minor turbine wheel clip would needed to preserve top end.


Your pocket book is going to hurt with a 30r and dual gates, something like a $1800-2000 dent.

Have you looked into SPL Quick Spool valves?

Your a manifold god! would you be able to make a kseries manfold based on a evo 9 twinscroll? Do you sell these manifold online or do you have to be in person to get one? I wouldnt mind buying one of these manifolds from you! You got some very good info on this! Now that you said this if i could take an evo 9 fp green bb and put it on a k24 the spooltime would be insane along with a steady insane amount of tq and hp all the way to almost redline (6500k) but wait FAB, Has anyone run a say a stock evo turbo on a honda enginer with out MAJOR modifications?




you and me man, andre has a sidewinder twinscroll jig, ep specific sitting on the bench right now. if you go 30r twinscroll you'll hit boost like me man.

or ctd's manifold (i think he said its twinscroll capable) next best thing.

how you not going to ask me about this in person? whats up with that?!



haha ma bad! I i was just seeing if anyone ever did this. I found a garrett twinscroll i had a while back just sitting in my garage so im thinking about putting that baby on. Hey is andre selling that manifold?

[Ctd-fab]

Lol, its just a bunch of metal :mwink:

I did try with a 8/9 but the 10 just seemed to fit better. I do think the 8/9 would work amazing in an FA/FG chassis though as a bottom mount.

Here is where I'm at with the Evo x setup. Turbine location set, just need to start messing with collectors angles and runner configurations.

http://a6.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/s320x320/316424_302921536390743_211261412223423_1421757_757 277304_n.jpg



My Honda D/B kits do not require any mods at all in fact. I was able to locate the turbo in such a way that it is AC, PS, and factory full length radiator compatible. I even made a full 3" downpipe off the turbo with a 2.5"open dump that was still ac compatible for one of my own cars back in the day. Here is a dyno of two Jeff Evans tuned stock GSR with evo9 turbo on just the gate (12psi) set-up overlayed with a 85x89mm b-series with a LHT intercooled JRSC at 9psi. Evo turbo is solid line, supercharged is dotted.

http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/302615_2220321742445_1079716021_2411922_1204900389 _n.jpg

http://www.azht.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57758&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1302738863

For comparison here is a dyno of a full race stage 2 Garrett bb GT turbo on a b18. $5k+ for what????

http://www.azht.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=57759&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1302738935



http://a2.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/206647_219999648016266_211261412223423_1019434_190 8603_n.jpg

Here is an FWD Sr20 setup with a Evo 8/9. Stock everything compatible, no mods. Should be dyno'd here soon and should make 300+ torque.

http://hphotos-sjc1.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/216323_219999621349602_211261412223423_1019433_627 221_n.jpg



Email me is you want to set something up, Vince@ctdfab.com . I might be able to take another go at a K + Evo 8/9 but I think the X is the way to go right now.


Think outside the box :mbiggrin:

[playap07]

CDT-FAB, yup i will be emailing you here soon then to see if you can make me a manifold that will fit this turbo. I dont think its a evo 9 turbo. i really dont know alot of information about this turbo since i got it 2 years ago from my friend. I know it has some info etched in it would you be able to make a flang for this baby?

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1387/5933973/18147047/399047796.jpg

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1387/5933973/18147047/399047795.jpg

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1387/5933973/18147047/399047792.jpg

http://pic20.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1387/5933973/18147047/399047791.jpg

[whatsvtec]

I need boost...

[sleepy ep3]

CDT-FAB, yup i will be emailing you here soon then to see if you can make me a manifold that will fit this turbo. I dont think its a evo 9 turbo. i really dont know alot of information about this turbo since i got it 2 years ago from my friend. I know it has some info etched in it would you be able to make a flang for this
Why would you have him make a special manifold just for that turbo? When that turbo fucks up, you're going to either have to find another one (which will be hard since you don't know what it is or what it came off of) or have a new flange welded on // have a new manifold made. I would just buy a common flange turbo, and be done with it. Plus making a downpipe for that turbo looks like it would be a pain in the ass

[playap07]

Why would you have him make a special manifold just for that turbo? When that turbo fucks up, you're going to either have to find another one (which will be hard since you don't know what it is or what it came off of) or have a new flange welded on // have a new manifold made. I would just buy a common flange turbo, and be done with it. Plus making a downpipe for that turbo looks like it would be a pain in the ass

I already have a revhard turbo manifold and turbo so if something ever breaks ill just throw that turbo back on. im not really worried about it. I want a special mani for it because i have twinscroll turbo and i dont want to sell it. I want to see what it can do on a k24a1. The flange on it looks similar to the revhard one i got. Its just that the manifold is not a twin scroll one so i cant run it with this current setup. From what i can see the only things i need to make this new turbo work on my set up is to find a mani, downpipe, add a nipple for the boost line to the wastegate and figure out if this thing is oil cooled or water cooled. For the downpipe i would just need to find a pipe that would bolt up to it and have a shop custom fab me up one. Should be a piece of cake!

[Ctd-fab]

lol, that is a standard turbo, a little weird but nothing too weird. Those 6 bolt flanges are old school but you can still get them. I personally would weld a 3" v band on the turbine housing to make a DP easier to fab and work with. Its only oil cooled btw.

Its just a t3 divided hotside, looks to be a 0.7 A/R divided which compares flow wise to a 0.42 A/R open housing. Also It will bolt right up to your revhard mani but without the divided manifold it won't have any benefits.

Seeing that you already have the turbo I would still say go with that sidewinder and buy a couple gates is still going to be your best best. In the EP engine bay there just isn't enough room to make a divided dual gated topmount.

Anyone who fabricates manifold should be able to get those turbine flanges easily. If you need one hit me up, I have some in stock.

[playap07]

O Okay thanks for the info. What is a V band?

Would you happen to know if this is a pretty good flowing turbo off of those specs?

I wouldnt mind a sidewinder mani but now that im thinking about it and doing some calculations i dont think i want to redo or buy new intercooler piping. I would just like a drop in, bolt up, plug and play type setup that compatible with the revhard kit.

CDT-FAB, would you be able to make a log mani that similar to the revhard one but modify it to be a twinscroll mani? Or would it be more beneficial to go sidwinder and have the piping modified to fit it?

[Ctd-fab]

It looks like it may be something like a garrett 3271 external gate housing. Its rated for 420 crank. Realistically I would say it would do 350whp easily, just a guess though.

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/catelog/Turbochargers/GT32/GT3271_452203_1.htm

A sidewinder is the only design that will easily fit that turbo and dual gates. You could do a quickspool valve and a open manifold but cost would be higher and I don't think its ever been done before. Who knows how it would work?

Piping is always the easy part. I'm sure you would just need a few mods to your existing piping and it would be done. Now the downpipe is the tough part, usually two piece and can get expensive. You will also need to reroute your heater hoses, wiring harness, and fuel line and add heat shielding.


Here is a vband assembly. No gasket needed and can rotate 360 degrees. One clamp

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR5glTowTcj4az-ilsxzllRff3CKZkj6A0ZSZJ1tLvp03--uhlG

[AKEP]

looks like andre's manifold is what you want then. hit him up.

[playap07]

It looks like it may be something like a garrett 3271 external gate housing. Its rated for 420 crank. Realistically I would say it would do 350whp easily, just a guess though.

http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbobygarrett/catelog/Turbochargers/GT32/GT3271_452203_1.htm

A sidewinder is the only design that will easily fit that turbo and dual gates. You could do a quickspool valve and a open manifold but cost would be higher and I don't think its ever been done before. Who knows how it would work?

Piping is always the easy part. I'm sure you would just need a few mods to your existing piping and it would be done. Now the downpipe is the tough part, usually two piece and can get expensive. You will also need to reroute your heater hoses, wiring harness, and fuel line and add heat shielding.


Here is a vband assembly. No gasket needed and can rotate 360 degrees. One clamp

http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR5glTowTcj4az-ilsxzllRff3CKZkj6A0ZSZJ1tLvp03--uhlG


O WOW! I like the sound of the Vband assembly! Im deff going to look into that!

What if i just run one wastegate? Would there be any fitment issues there?

Whats the purpose of 2 wastegates? Is it for high hp applications?



Yea AKEP im hit him up and see what he got too.

[ginger]

vince can build anything, hes an amazing fabricator.

the purpose of twin waste gates on a twin scroll set up, is that to release exhaust gases from both sides of the manifold as its divided all the way to the turbo.

and id go with the evo x turbo, or get a 35r on vinces top mount, good for 380+ on stock fuel pressure. aka more than enough for the street.

btw vince ill see you tomorrow, like 330 ish. wont be doing all the work got to get to the race track by 6ish up by pleasant