Is this enough to get you to leave your EP3?

[ryboto]

I like small hatches, I imagine a lot of us here to, or we wouldn't have bought an ep3. I've stayed away from the STI/WRX game, because I don't necessarily like the looks/size/price of the cars....but now we're seeing a change in the US. First the Veloster, Mazda hints at a Turbo 2(turbo Mazda 2) (http://www.autoblog.com/2011/11/02/mazda-turbo2-concept-promises-forced-induction-frolicking/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+weblogsinc%2Fautoblog+%28Auto blog%29), and now Ford announces the Focus ST and Fiesta ST (http://www.motortrend.com/features/auto_news/2011/1111_ford_focus_st_str_and_fiesta_coming_to_la/). A focus with 2.0L, 250 hp and as much torque? Sure it's a 5-door, but then there's also the Fiesta with 180hp and 177ft-lbs of torque...AND a 6-speed!

I keep telling myself that even with the price of a swap, I'll spend less if I hang on to the EP3, but with these more powerful, and more fuel efficient options, should I let myself be tempted? Is anyone else feeling the same?

[PRODIUS]

I recently swapped a 07 K24a2 and could not be happier, with 240/220 respectfully, she's a blast to drive, good on gas and cheap on insurance. You'll surprise most new cars and easily beat many contemporary rivals due to our much lighter weight, even if we're down on power. I also have a JRSC that I may put on next year to join the 300+ club.

Keep it, she's worth it!

[showoff3civic]

I already left the ep3 for an Evo X and by far with all the mods of the EP3 the evo is faster, handles better, and more comftorable on a long drive.

I have over 40k into the civic and with mods and price of the evo I am under 35k

[andyman97]

I already left the ep3 for an Evo X and by far with all the mods of the EP3 the evo is faster, handles better, and more comftorable on a long drive.

I have over 40k into the civic and with mods and price of the evo I am under 35k

Ouch, what did you spend 40k on? I have less than 25 invested in mine and that includes the car and it's a mid ten second car.

[apexracing]

I already left the ep3 for an Evo X and by far with all the mods of the EP3 the evo is faster, handles better, and more comftorable on a long drive.

I have over 40k into the civic and with mods and price of the evo I am under 35k

your evo isnt a hatch back. And because its a 190 mph car stock, its not really a far comparison to the ep3. But if i had the cash or free'd up credit i'd buy another evo 9 and be done with it. There is something to be said about having forged suspension components from the factory.

[BeaterEP]

For me it comes down to a couple of factors.
Like a few have said already, money is the primary one. My EP is paid off. If the motor blows tomorrow, the one-time cost of a fun swap is still far less than buying a while new car and having payments for another 3-5 years.
The other big thing for me is just personal preference. I've been driving this car since I picked her up brand new in '03. I know this car like the back of my hand, know exactly how she'll handle. I know right where she could use a little improvement and where she's already set.
I also know that despite marketing to the contrary, there are very few manufacturers out there whose motors will run as strong as this one has right past 200k (219,900 and counting :mwink:)
Love my EP3, my Honda, and my car in that order!

/$.02

[apexracing]

For me it comes down to a couple of factors.
Like a few have said already, money is the primary one. My EP is paid off. If the motor blows tomorrow, the one-time cost of a fun swap is still far less than buying a while new car and having payments for another 3-5 years.
The other big thing for me is just personal preference. I've been driving this car since I picked her up brand new in '03. I know this car like the back of my hand, know exactly how she'll handle. I know right where she could use a little improvement and where she's already set.



I also know that despite marketing to the contrary, there are very few manufacturers out there whose motors will run as strong as this one has right past 200k (219,900 and counting :mwink:)
Love my EP3, my Honda, and my car in that order!

/$.02
I agree with this statement 203k and counting here, 03 as well. original clutch even hehe

[BeaterEP]

DAAAAYUUUUMMMM!!! :meek:
My OEM clutch was just about ready to disintegrate when I replaced it...at about 160k miles. :mbiggrin:

[apexracing]

other than i think it puked a spring because it whines when going down the road, the clutch engages and disengages perfectly, and doesnt slip at all.

[02TWSI]

your evo isnt a hatch back. And because its a 190 mph car stock, its not really a far comparison to the ep3. But if i had the cash or free'd up credit i'd buy another evo 9 and be done with it. There is something to be said about having forged suspension components from the factory.


It's much more than just that.

I ditched my EP for my evo 9 and the thing is a beast.

[ryboto]

I personally don't ever want anything more than a fun DD, so I don't plan on doing any overly expensive mods...a swap, upgraded bolt ons, and maybe a paint job down the road.

[PRODIUS]

Evo is a great, great car...but nothing like the EP on many levels, good and bad. Obviously.
A closer comparison like the thread starter indicated is another Hatch: MazdaSpeed 3, WRX/STI 5 door, Focus/Fiesta ST, Turbo Veloster, Genesis turbo coup. All are fun cars, all are likely faster out of the box, but all are more expensive then upgrading an EP to a competitive and modest level of power. My car was purchased new, has been paid for 5 years and never needed anything. A 5000$ engine upgrade is just what the car needed. It's now good for 9 more years of fun driving!

Let's not kid ourselves, few of us are track racers ( contrary to how most people talk) so most of these would make great DD.
If you want to drive the new Focus ST just check out a Speed3 or to a lesser extent the Volvo C30. They are all built on the same platform and should provide a good idea. Except for the Mazda's fugly looks...blah.

[ryboto]

Yea, at this point, I'm only interested in small hatches. I don't see that changing. The Subraru hatch design is borderline too big for me, I prefer the two-door size/look.

[Blah1219]

I hate the idea to having a new car. First you got those payments go through, its car prison. Second not many parts are out in the market, but they do show they are expensive. I've always liked the idea of buying an older car and building it to your specs and needs. Get a Mitsubishi mirage and turn it into a Evo III replica. Or for hatchback go with a... I don't know. I see more of these new cars on the side of road.

Also forgot, no modding or no dealership warranty.

[showoff3civic]

Ouch, what did you spend 40k on? I have less than 25 invested in mine and that includes the car and it's a mid ten second car.

http://tinyurl.com/68smd99


your evo isnt a hatch back. And because its a 190 mph car stock, its not really a far comparison to the ep3. But if i had the cash or free'd up credit i'd buy another evo 9 and be done with it. There is something to be said about having forged suspension components from the factory.

The Evo is actually gear limited to 158 :mangel: but you could get a Ralliart, has the same 4B11 as the evo and its a hatch.

[Blue03Si]

My car will be paid off next year and it will be my DD for the indefinite future. I'm waiting to see what Subaru does with the 2013 STI and if I like it I'll be picking one up and storing it in the garage with a set of track wheels and R-comps. I'll still drive the Si daily, but it will be releaved from auto-x duties and track day duties. If I don't like the 2013 STI or there isn't one then I think I'll be doing an engine swap and consider picking up a Ducati.

[gamma6]

I keep thinking the same way as the op, and i hate it... all these new cars stock turbo this and that, with high gas milage and all the bells and whistles... i hate it... i just think of the whole climate control of the rsx is a luxury to me while i hate to turn on and off my heater/AC just to get the temp right... it pisses me off... that just goes away once i start driving her and my love for her resumes... too me the ep is like a base model car :( and all these new cars with different features makes it worse... i dont plan on selling my ep, im gonna throw my sc and call it a day, i try to accept it for what it is... if i want those bells and whistles (which i do) ill just buy a car that has em STOCK... just sucks how far back it sets the ep...

[DRP967]

I dont plan on selling my EP3 and another hot hatch is not what I am looking for so none of the cars mentioned are on my priority list. I will say the Veloster has impressed me, its a nice car. Radical design/body lines, 3 door (not a new idea but pretty unique), fuel efficient, available in manual, many standard features for the price, etc. I even made a thread inquiring about this car and praised it.

http://blog.irwinzone.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/irwin_hyundai_veloster_white.jpg
Not much to look at in stock form but with a drop, wheels, and tint this thing will look even better. CRZ eat your heart out with your craptastic MPGs you HYBRID. Hyundai has really set the benchmark for fuel efficiency, most of their models get 40+ MPG and are not even hybrids. Honda...you are falling more and more behind but I know you know that and choose to do nothing so it is what it is. Cant stop the Krooks...err I mean Koreans.
This might not make sense but in photos the Veloster looks mediocre at best but when rolling, it just looks right. Check out this youtube video of this white one with LEDs. Looks stunning.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BQHiMIonx0I

*Same goes for the EP3, most people agree with me that the car looks better rolling than it does at a stand still. Which is why I am constantly rolling...over 180K on my 05 NHBP. Okay thats not just the reason, I love driving so I go anywhere and everywhere. The EP3 to me has been love/hate, but everytime I get inside and start her up, take control of the dash mounted shifter, and throttle up I feel good....its a not so common Civic and people still ask me what the thing is. We all know about the EP3 admiration threads so I will leave it at that.

In conclusion, if your getting bored of your EP3 and want something faster w/more torque and possibly more fuel efficient, then there are some pretty good candidates out there. My next car needs to have some power, but with the EP3 I am just fine with it the way it is. I would like better fuel efficiency but thats a small request since her MPGs are already decent. Plus I love the fact she only needs 87.

[makavelibranded]

I already left the ep3 for an Evo X and by far with all the mods of the EP3 the evo is faster, handles better, and more comftorable on a long drive.

I have over 40k into the civic and with mods and price of the evo I am under 35k


:rofl: how does buying JDM crap have anything to do with how a car performs? Spent 40k on a civic? all that says is you wasted a ton of your cash. Your too low so of course your car is going to handle worse then the evo, tien coilovers are crap, and you wasted alot of cash on an all motor setup that easily could have been better spent a reliable turbo setup that could have easily out done an evo X.

[02TWSI]

In the end, its still front wheel drive.

[andyman97]

In the end, its still front wheel drive.

Which means you need less power to go just as fast. Sure, you aren't going to pull 60' times as quick as awd but your top end will scream at the same hp as an awd.

[BlownSi05]

I hate the idea to having a new car. First you got those payments go through, its car prison. Second not many parts are out in the market, but they do show they are expensive.

Welcome to my world....lol. Had the EP paid off for over 2 years before I bought the GT500. Thank God the car lights my fire every single time I start it, otherwise the payment would drive me nuts!

There are some exciting hatchback stuff going on. Some really nice hatches are already out and more are on the way. The EP has a style about it that no others do in my opinion, but as much as I hate to admit it, it is dated. Still, there is not another hatch out there that is even close to similar, and with a smart couple grand into it, the EP will compete without much issue.

[ryboto]

There are some exciting hatchback stuff going on. Some really nice hatches are already out and more are on the way. The EP has a style about it that no others do in my opinion, but as much as I hate to admit it, it is dated. Still, there is not another hatch out there that is even close to similar, and with a smart couple grand into it, the EP will compete without much issue.

See, I love the EP3 design, I still think it beats most of these new hatches. While the Focus ST definitely overpowers our EP3, it looks atrocious, as does the Fiesta. The only thing that looks semi-decent is that Turbo2, but that's a racing concept, and a production version will probably look just as silly and lame as the Mazda2. Just look at how different the Speed3 is compared to the base model...

My biggest gripe with the car is the power/mpg. I suppose a swap will fix that, but I'm still bummed that it has to come to that. It's still a blast to drive, and great to look at!

[usedep3]

... If I don't like the 2013 STI or there isn't one then I think I'll be doing an engine swap and consider picking up a Ducati.

Ducati = WINNING!

[BlownSi05]

wtf are you talking about? my 5sp no less 06 evo 9 se did 185mph all day every day. must be the new evo's are shitty.

An Evo pulling 185mph? Stock or heavily modded?

[Kibble Fat]

Fiesta ST coming too

[makavelibranded]

While the Focus ST definitely overpowers our EP3, it looks atrocious, as does the Fiesta.

I really enjoy the looks of them and theres a fiesta that autocrosses here and the thing is pretty damn good, I only hate Fords damn "not a fake scripted commercial" scripted commercials though.

[Blue03Si]

Fiesta ST coming too

If they find a way to put in an independent rear suspension and ditch the torsion beam rear suspension I'd be interested. No interest unless the suspension has been completely reworked.

[willy_akino]

I wouldn't trade my car. Its fully paid off and i worked hard to pay it off. I'm in the same boat as Blue03si keep my ep3 as a DD and buy another better sports car in the future. I don't make enough to buy a new car specially since I went back to school.

[88fox05si]

My hatch is nearly paid off. It's an 05 model with 83k miles, all stock.
Sometimes I think that the car isn't as fun to drive, but I'll drive the GF's DX-VP 05 civic, and my car shines
again. I daily drive the EP because it get decent mileage and offers fun, predicable handling. It's a blast to drive at auto-x events too. I
know it's limitations and understeer tendencies. My other car, that's another story: not stock, but looks it. An 88 Fox that tear up the auto-x.

Bottom line: Keeping the hatch until 2 doors don't work anymore. Looking forward to having no payments .

[Kibble Fat]

Working at Ford, driving a Honda FTW! I really need to get one of those "Out of a job yet?" stickers and cut off the punchline.

I think I'll be done with FWDs after this car... maybe in 3 years when it reaches 200k

[ttttrigg3r]

The only thing right now that keeps me still loyal to Honda is the brand recognition of being cheap and reliable. It's worked so far for me with the EP and 4 past civics/crx. The Ford and Hyundai brands are very very attractive with all their numbers, but I haven't heard anything about them being reliable at all. If anything I heard a lot about Fords breaking down. If Hyundai can make a decent car with the 40mpg highway and 160hp+ and still pump 87 and has an established reputation for long running engines then I'm sold.

[Johnny]

Their are some very nice hatches coming out. I can actually say, I like the hatches coming out next year.


seriously what i would consider mild mods exhaust ic and piping 18 psi 300 whp. i mean come on are there any other evo 9 owners on here?


And i've had plenty of witnesses, i can provide testimonies, can start giving out phone numbers lol. Smoked a 2000's svt cobra mustang with that car.

Please, stop it. Your making me laugh lol. Can you post the numbers here because some of us would like to make some phone calls.

[BeaterEP]

:popcorn:

...this should be fun to watch.

[bearcat91]

what about the mazdaspeed 3?! Sexy hatch

[apexracing]

The problem op, is your rarely going to find a car that is both reliable, fuel efficient 35mpg+, and powerful. So at some point you have to ask your self what it is you need a car for.

[02TWSI]

what about the mazdaspeed 3?! Sexy hatch



Great car ^

[DRP967]

what about the mazdaspeed 3?! Sexy hatch

The old ones are nice, the new ones are just to big/dinosaur like.

[hyu]

Doubt I will upgrade anytime soon. Valetting has made me drive every car imaginable and then some. Granted I would love a CL65 Amg but realistically it's not feasible and out of my pricerange. I am however loving the 2011 Subaru WRX's flared body lines. Buddy got one and I think I might have to car swap with him a couple of days

[STP03BlueSI]

Highly doubt I would leave my EP3. Only reason to leave it as if it got totalled. (KNOCK ON WOOD that never happens). I love the EP3 way to much..shit I love it more than my gf.

[DRP967]

Highly doubt I would leave my EP3. Only reason to leave it as if it got totalled. (KNOCK ON WOOD that never happens). I love the EP3 way to much..shit I love it more than my gf.

Now thats love.

I love mine more than my ATF.

[03civicdopejmd]

hatches can do it all... Think about how accessible these cars are.. WRX/lancers=pricey insurance, same as any new car.. Payin off 5g's in a year for a fresh engine sounds much better then buying a newer car with payments for 5years.. Do a swap, get financially stable, then get a fun car... And fun cars are cheap these days! M3's/oldersubies/awd vw's/audi's/oldernsx's in the future are realistic, you can get a nice car sports car for under 15k in five years!

Also dont forget about audi and vdubs' still makin hatches to this day..

[powdbyrice]

buy a well performing car from the factory unless you have deep pockets to throw at a nearly 10yr old civic.

[bizzle]

Now thats love.

I love mine more than my ATF.
More than your alcohol, tobacco and firearms?
More than your automatic transmission fluid?

[BeaterEP]

LOL I was tryin to figure that one out too!

[DRP967]

More than your alcohol, tobacco and firearms?
More than your automatic transmission fluid?

ATF = all time favorite

Its a mongering term for those who partake in relaxation sessions.

[ep3k20]

seriously what i would consider mild mods exhaust ic and piping 18 psi 300 whp. i mean come on are there any other evo 9 owners on here?


And i've had plenty of witnesses, i can provide testimonies, can start giving out phone numbers lol. Smoked a 2000's svt cobra mustang with that car. well if it was a 99-00 cobra that's not really saying much. Only 325 hp (which is why svt got sued because they actually made less hp than that which is why they never made a 02 cobra) if it was a termi cobra I highly doubt you beat one cause stock those cars make 390 hp (which has been confirmed under rated by svt they make more like 430 ) I have seen bone stock termi cobras destroy new gt500s. Shit even my heavily modded sn95 cobra has got spanked by them.(obviously not stock)

[Karma]

buy a well performing car from the factory unless you have deep pockets to throw at a nearly 10yr old civic.

Agreed.

I'll be honest with myself and say I've been craving a new car, something similar to the EP and something completely different. Only issue is I can't afford anything so my EP will have to do for the next few years. I'll put money into my car just to keep it running, but I won't be trying to 'upgrade' it.

Even if I did have the money, I would not get rid of the EP, but I would get another car.

[Johnny]

Why are you asking permission to PM me? I'm not President Obama. No one said you couldn't defend a manufacture but why get so defensive over your "Evo". Sat in one? LMAO, Your talking about an Evo, interiour that looks like puke (not to bash on your car but really, it's got crappy plastic everywhere), so no, it's not a Ferrari 458. How old are you? I think you've been watching to much fast and furious.


BTW, I have an Fbody, 355ci, so yes, I've been in fast cars, not just quick.

That link you posted. I'm just shaking my head. What world do you live in? I'm producing over 400hp to the tires and have yet to hit 190mph and your saying your hitting 185 in a stock Evo? I'm not saying I couldn't hit it but your producing well under 100 hp then I am and our cars are almost the same in weight. If you can hit that speed, damn, your going to need a looooong highway. Post a video of your stock car hitting 185 while destroying everyone around you please. We need proof, not internet talk.

Hey wait a second, my pm box is still empty.

[BlownSi05]

Heres a little info i found in a search while waiting for resposes for phone numbers.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/evo-general/520976-top-speed-gear-ratio-final-drive.html

5spd info in there too.


That link is nothing but conjecture and theory. Hell, if I do that kind of calculation with my car, based on my stupidly long 5th and 6th gears, the car should blow past 250mph......

My car in stock form is running 482rwhp/479wtq, which if you put that at a 14%-17% drivetrain loss for RWD is a bit higher than the factory rated 540hp/510tq at the flywheel. My car, a 2010 which still has the iron block, tops out at 184.7mph in stock form in 5th gear (http://www.popularmechanics.com/cars/news/vintage-speed/mustang-vs-camaro-bonneville-2), at which point aerodynamic drag keeps the car from getting any more (which of course could be dealt with in mods.) To compare, my car runs the same power plant as the Ford GT, minus the slightly more aggressive cam in the GT and the iron block. Power difference is within 10hp, yet the GT because of it aerodynamics, smashes up to 200mph+ with ease.

Everyone knows 4WD cars do not produce the top end pull like a FWD or RWD car does, so this is also working against it, as well as aerodynamic drag.

I am not trying to bash the Evo, as I said before I have always been a fan of the Evo and love the car. It is a blast of a car to drive. But you are kinda talking out your arse. You would need a lot more in an Evo 9/X than stock power to hit those kind of speeds.

Oh, and send those stock Evo's my way; my baby always likes a good snack!:mangel::meek:

[bearcat91]

hatches can do it all... Think about how accessible these cars are.. WRX/lancers=pricey insurance, same as any new car.. Payin off 5g's in a year for a fresh engine sounds much better then buying a newer car with payments for 5years.. Do a swap, get financially stable, then get a fun car... And fun cars are cheap these days! M3's/oldersubies/awd vw's/audi's/oldernsx's in the future are realistic, you can get a nice car sports car for under 15k in five years!

Also dont forget about audi and vdubs' still makin hatches to this day..

Audi a3 is nice...R32 is sweet too!