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View Full Version : Buddy Club N+ vs HFP vs OEM ITR suspension



EP3Lov3
10-21-2013, 08:55 AM
I've had by N+ for a while now, and they handle really well and a lot better than other coils i've experienced (d2,ksport) but they are very stiff and i can't see myself paying to get them rebuilt while i can just get used hfp or oem itr suspension. also, i do auto-cross and track 5-10 times a year but this car is my daily driver and the spring rates are super high and the car is not comfortable at all. makes me think its not worth having super stiff suspension only for the couple times i hit the track. my question is; how well can the car perform/handle even with the itr suspension or hfp? not sure if i'm comparing apples and oranges here... has anyone went from hfp/itr to coilovers or vice versa? how did it feel? pros/cons? or are there any other coilovers that would better suit my needs?(looked into fortune auto with custom spring rates as a standard option) also i dont care much for ride height adjustment. thanks in advance!

Powers
10-21-2013, 11:25 AM
I'm on aspecs with a few other mods and I have to say the car handles very well. I can't see myself switching to anything else just yet. I'm running a cusco rear sway function seven lower tie bar and rear lca's itr front lca's itr front swaybar pci offset spherical bears buddy club rear camber kit ingalls camber bolts and wilwoods for unsprung weight loss.

It handles beautifully and has a good ride for dding aswell.

Hasbro
10-21-2013, 03:00 PM
You can post numbers almost as good - say less than a second slower. And the car on the street will be more enjoyable and handle better under less than ideal road surfaces. The part you won't like is the increased lean.

What kind of tires?

Alignment?

How many miles do you drive a year?

EP3Lov3
10-21-2013, 06:24 PM
You can post numbers almost as good - say less than a second slower. And the car on the street will be more enjoyable and handle better under less than ideal road surfaces. The part you won't like is the increased lean. What kind of tires? Alignment? How many miles do you drive a year?

1. 225/45/17 Goodyear eagle f1 asymmetric 2

2. -1.5 camber up front and -.75 rear, 0 toe front and rear, cant remember caster

3. 12k a year

Hasbro
10-21-2013, 09:54 PM
If you can handle only a 3/4" drop (see Power's build thread pics) you might be pleased. If you want better handling you can use a more severe alignment (camber and caster), play with rear bars, get Michelin Pilot Super Sports, etc. if you want better handling with the 12k miles a year. Very nice Max Summer tires and considerably better handling than the Good Years. If that's not enough you can go Extreme Summers but the mileage takes a hit.

b_ron
10-22-2013, 07:59 PM
Anywhere else you can find used HFP or ITR suspension? It's getting pretty hard to find nowadays.

EP3Lov3
10-22-2013, 08:20 PM
I'm on aspecs with a few other mods and I have to say the car handles very well. I can't see myself switching to anything else just yet. I'm running a cusco rear sway function seven lower tie bar and rear lca's itr front lca's itr front swaybar pci offset spherical bears buddy club rear camber kit ingalls camber bolts and wilwoods for unsprung weight loss.

It handles beautifully and has a good ride for dding aswell.

What's the benefit of the itr front lca and the pci spherical? any more info on this such as links to other threads?

tlikethedrink
10-23-2013, 11:01 AM
Anywhere else you can find used HFP or ITR suspension? It's getting pretty hard to find nowadays.

Curry Acura online. go with the Aspec which is the most similar to the two. upgrade to a beefy rear sway. i havent been able to find one but the RSX Aspec rear sway is supposed to be 32mm. then again i havent been looking to hard or much at all. $590 bnib

someone said there is an Ebay seller that has used (>30k miles) ITR set ups. for around $300-$400.

Hasbro
10-23-2013, 11:16 AM
32mm bar, must be hollow. A TypeR bar is a very nice 22mm and the RSXS 21mm can be found for very little on CRSX.

Powers
10-23-2013, 11:30 AM
The itr lower control arms are for reduced unsprung weight and some say the gain some caster with them. The pci spherical bearings are offset for more caster and are solid bushings. There is no flex in them at all so basically when I rip around a turn my alignment doesn't change for that brief amount of time.

EP3Lov3
10-23-2013, 03:29 PM
The itr lower control arms are for reduced unsprung weight and some say the gain some caster with them. The pci spherical bearings are offset for more caster and are solid bushings. There is no flex in them at all so basically when I rip around a turn my alignment doesn't change for that brief amount of time.


I'm gonna look into the lca with the spherical bushings, any links from where to buy the bearing along with the itr lca?

Hasbro
10-24-2013, 12:48 AM
I'm gonna look into the lca with the spherical bushings, any links from where to buy the bearing along with the itr lca?

I found my R lcas on CRSX.com used for $250.00. I've seen them for less there also. They are well worth it.

EP3Lov3
10-24-2013, 06:50 AM
I found my R lcas on CRSX.com used for $250.00. I've seen them for less there also. They are well worth it.

Would i need an alignment after? also, where can i buy the spherical bushings?

Hasbro
10-24-2013, 02:15 PM
Would i need an alignment after? also, where can i buy the spherical bushings?

Definitely. You will also need the front R bar and lca bushing for the ball joint/rca from King Motorsports. Ask Powers about the sphericals bushings or search.

Sounds like a pain but it's not.

Powers
10-24-2013, 03:17 PM
I spent way to much on my r lca's and front sway. But either way Brain slames is who I spoke to over email from pci I sent the control arms to him to have the bushings installed.

EP3Lov3
10-25-2013, 06:37 AM
Definitely. You will also need the front R bar and lca bushing for the ball joint/rca from King Motorsports. Ask Powers about the sphericals bushings or search.

Sounds like a pain but it's not.

I'm gonna go with 05-06 a spec kit and here's what I'll buy with it

1. Pci spherical bushings
2. Dc5-r LCA
3. Dc5-r front sway
4. Bushings from king motorsports

Am I missing anything from that list that is needed/recommended?

Powers
10-25-2013, 07:05 AM
A fat rear sway bar and you would be set with that.

EP3Lov3
10-25-2013, 10:39 AM
A fat rear sway bar and you would be set with that.

I'll see how my 06 RSX-S sway does, If I'm not happy with it I'll get the progress sway bar

Hasbro
10-25-2013, 10:47 AM
The Progress bar is only 1mm larger (do they still make the 24mm bar?) than the S bar but has a solid attachment. If you don't mind the extra expense an adjustable bar would be top tier.

EP3Lov3
10-25-2013, 11:22 AM
The Progress bar is only 1mm larger (do they still make the 24mm bar?) than the S bar but has a solid attachment. If you don't mind the extra expense an adjustable bar would be top tier.

I can't wait to do all of this next year, really getting tired of my coilovers..... maybe if this wasn't my daily driver i'd keep them but I need it to function on all surfaces.

EP3Lov3
10-25-2013, 11:32 AM
Another thing I'll have to do is figure out why my wheels stick out further on the passenger side than the driver's side. Alignment is the same all around..... It's been bothering me for a while now

Hasbro
10-25-2013, 12:24 PM
Curious, if only for my own edification, what psi are you running for street and autox and where are your damper settings for street and autox? Maybe you could adjust them to a passable street level.

I imagine N+ dampers have a similar poor response to bumps as Koni Sports do. Sports, also only single adjustable, are really only good for smooth surface performance. However, they can be made to be quite street able by softening the adjustments and reducing psi.

A really top notch damper with your spring sizes can adjusted to be perfectly fine for street driving, albeit pretty firm. In other words, it's usually the damper that's the problem, not the spring. And the majority of guys that have adjustable systems usually screw it up - including me. The more I research, the more I realize I still don't know what I doing compared to an expert tuner. One sage suspension guru really pushes for what he calls "the 85th percentile". It's a street/track able tune that is tweaked back a bit because it's so much more reasonable and is usually faster most of the time except at the extreme end. In the end it's much more enjoyable.

Sorry, babbling again. Been talking to True Choice and others today, all wound up.:mbiggrin:

EP3Lov3
10-25-2013, 04:02 PM
Curious, if only for my own edification, what psi are you running for street and autox and where are your damper settings for street and autox? Maybe you could adjust them to a passable street level.

I imagine N+ dampers have a similar poor response to bumps as Koni Sports do. Sports, also only single adjustable, are really only good for smooth surface performance. However, they can be made to be quite street able by softening the adjustments and reducing psi.

A really top notch damper with your spring sizes can adjusted to be perfectly fine for street driving, albeit pretty firm. In other words, it's usually the damper that's the problem, not the spring. And the majority of guys that have adjustable systems usually screw it up - including me. The more I research, the more I realize I still don't know what I doing compared to an expert tuner. One sage suspension guru really pushes for what he calls "the 85th percentile". It's a street/track able tune that is tweaked back a bit because it's so much more reasonable and is usually faster most of the time except at the extreme end. In the end it's much more enjoyable.

Sorry, babbling again. Been talking to True Choice and others today, all wound up.:mbiggrin:

you know, i might do that instead actually. im gonna be pulling the coilovers off to raise the car and replace some bushings so i'll adjust the damping to very soft then stiffen in from there. would I benefit from extended balljoints even if im only going to be lowered an inch or so?

Hasbro
10-25-2013, 06:03 PM
I believe USAirForce stated there is a benefit but you are ok until about 1 1/4".

You might call Buddy Club to find out the best damping level for street. Do you have to remove the damper to adjust? I'm not familiar with them but if the dampers are only sold with specific weight springs they came with then a medium setting would most likely be at the middle, say at 8 clicks. Depending on where you are set at now (-4k to +4k) would help determine how soft you should go. Maybe -2k, I don't know. Get on CRSX.com and ask. There are a ton of guys there using N+ and they will set you up very quickly.

This afternoon, after following this thread, I played with my Konis to find a nice comfortable but fast street setting. I went to 1 full turn (40% from full soft) in the front and to 2/3 turn from soft (50%, middle) in the rear. Warmed the tires (love that smell, lol) from 37 cold all around to 40.5 front, 39.5 rear. I took 1 lb. from all tires, 39.5/38.5. I guess around 36 cold now. Apples and oranges to someone else's set up but the ratios might cross over. I have 336f/515r springs but on a stock weight EP that translates to about 425 lb. springs front/ 700 rear so we aren't that far off, you being at 560/784.

Sorry, rambling again.

Oh, to anyone interested, that soft setting gave me a very mild oversteer while at a constant throttle and no letting off. I tried it several times to confirm. I wouldn't try accelerating nor decelerating due to testing on a circle with curbs.

EP3Lov3
10-27-2013, 07:37 AM
Figured out what I'm going to do, gonna take off my coilovers and take them apart, lube them, replace bushings, tighten everything down with some Loctite. I'll also swap out the springs for some Swift springs with the same spring rates. Hopefully I'll have some extra cash to get the front DC5-R bits and pieces. I know barely anyone says this but I can't wait to raise my car about half an inch. I think I'm too low right now

b_ron
10-29-2013, 08:30 PM
Is the ITR suspension the same/similar to usdm Type S?

tlikethedrink
10-29-2013, 09:43 PM
Is the ITR suspension the same/similar to usdm Type S?

ITR is most like Aspec