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FailureToStop
01-31-2003, 04:07 PM
I had Progress springs installed by a local tire place and had it aligned. I kept the old springs and they put them in the Progress box. When I got home I noticed that there were two black rubber pieces that were marked S6A. They are about 6" long and look like they attach to the ends of the struts. They look uncut.

Is this normal? The green sheet that came with the Progress says to use the stock bumpstops, but I am not sure if the part that I have in the box is the bumpstop.

ep3
01-31-2003, 10:23 PM
i think those are the stock bumpstops. i took mine out because the ground controls had replacements for the front.

simann
02-02-2003, 09:04 PM
Uh, last time I did my coilover conversion on my old 2001 Lx coupe civic(traded for Si) Bumpstops were little 2'' Diameter by1/2"thick Yellow rubber pieces. Are these pieces HOLLOW?
If so these are just dust covers.

FailureToStop
02-03-2003, 12:31 AM
They are hollow and they look like they fit over the ends of the shocks.

Are these dust covers? Because those are the parts I am talking about.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 05:21 AM
Originally posted by FailureToStop
They are hollow and they look like they fit over the ends of the shocks.

Are these dust covers? Because those are the parts I am talking about.
LOL! yes those are dust covers...I'd put them back on to keep crap from getting all over your shocks

ep3
02-03-2003, 09:10 AM
helms manual says bumpstop.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 11:21 AM
Originally posted by ep3
helms manual says bumpstop.
what I'm looking at looks like dust covers, they are hollow, and are too weak to keept from being a bumpstop.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 11:23 AM
here's a better pic of what I think he's talking about...
http://www.pryor.ws/honda/pics/HRSprings05.JPG
see that black thing in between the coils...that's the dust cover...is this what you have failuretostop?

ep3
02-03-2003, 12:34 PM
02SilverSiHB, do you have a pic of the stock bumpstop??? if those are just dust covers, i need to take out my stock bumpstops,cuz i put the my replacments in there as well.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by ep3
02SilverSiHB, do you have a pic of the stock bumpstop??? if those are just dust covers, i need to take out my stock bumpstops,cuz i put the my replacments in there as well.
you know, I actually left mine in there and never even took it out...this is for the front, so I'm not sure what the front ones look like. But from what I have heard on here, is that the bumpstop is integrated into the front shock....I need to find this out, as I am curious also.
But as for the rear, you know which ones they are right? They are shapped like a cone and are like a hard foam piece.

ep3
02-03-2003, 02:08 PM
i know the ones for the back because i had to cut them in half. but for the front, i took out those dust covers because the helms manual said they were the bumpstops, and ground control said i had to replace them with the ones they had provided. also on the instructons that ground control gave, the drawing of the front bumpstop was quite similar to that dust cover, and i also looked it up in the helms manual, that was the piece. i'm not saying your wrong, i just want to know if i pulled the right piece out, and if not i need to put it back in.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 02:16 PM
Originally posted by ep3
i know the ones for the back because i had to cut them in half. but for the front, i took out those dust covers because the helms manual said they were the bumpstops, and ground control said i had to replace them with the ones they had provided. also on the instructons that ground control gave, the drawing of the front bumpstop was quite similar to that dust cover, and i also looked it up in the helms manual, that was the piece. i'm not saying your wrong, i just want to know if i pulled the right piece out, and if not i need to put it back in.

well crap, if you have a helms manual and it looks very similar, it make me wonder what the heck is going on. It just seems they wouldn't be strong enough to hold the impact in case of bottoming out. I do understand ground control wanting you to take them out since you have the sleeves to put in there. I need to get to the bottom of this....

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 02:21 PM
looks like you might be right ep3. I went to 7thgencivic.com and did a search, came up with this: http://www.7thgencivic.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=64538&STARTPAGE=1
They start out talking about the rear, but then about second from the bottom, one guy replies talking about trimming the front ones. He even refers to it as a dust cover at the same time. So this is totally confusing me...I didn't think these things were strong enough to do this type of work. I'm totally new with this new front suspension. So that's 2 sources now, you and that site, I'd say you're right.

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 03:14 PM
Well, make that 3 confirmations:
http://www.7thgencivic.com/forum//messageview.cfm?catid=44&threadid=74972&STARTPAGE=1
That kills me...it's a bumpstop! ha, anyway, I'm trimming mine asap, that's why my car hops some times and feels a little harsh at times.

simann
02-03-2003, 03:31 PM
(They are hollow and they look like they fit over the ends of the shocks.

Are these dust covers? Because those are the parts I am talking about.)

FailureToStop has attached this image:






THOSE ARNT BUMPSTOPS!!!!!!!!! Its the dust covers, put those back on! It keeps rocks and dust from scoring the shock shaft!
Its imperative for the life of your shocks!Bump stops look like little donuts, those are flexible rubber cylinders!

Take your car back to the shop and get em back on!:eek:

simann
02-03-2003, 03:36 PM
Bump stops are little pieces to keep your struts from bottoming out on compression, if they are not on there , if you jump something or even roll over somthing big, the oil pressure in the shock may be to great under compression, thus the strut might blow. I have NEVER heard of a 6" ( SIX INCH) long bump stop!

FailureToStop
02-03-2003, 08:48 PM
Ok this is confusing me.

02Silver,

In your picture, the black rubber right under the green glove and covering the shock is what I am talking about.

I have to buy the Helms manual to see what's up. The dustcover or whatever it is :), if compressed looks like it can also act as a bumpstomp. While it may not be the primary one it could be a secondary stop.

If you still have your instructions from Progress, take a look at the pictures. The bumpstop that they show to trim looks like the rubber piece I am talking about.

... shit I hope I can get more confirmation before I go back to the tire place.

simann
02-03-2003, 09:22 PM
the piece right undr\er the glove IS the dust cover. Again bumpstops are little1 to 2 inch THICK by 2 or so inch width little donuts that are ONLY at the top of the strut, which in turn ARE COVERD BY THE DUST COVER.

ep3
02-03-2003, 09:28 PM
simann, have you seen the stock front bumpstop???

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:31 PM
Originally posted by simann
the piece right undr\er the glove IS the dust cover. Again bumpstops are little1 to 2 inch THICK by 2 or so inch width little donuts that are ONLY at the top of the strut, which in turn ARE COVERD BY THE DUST COVER.
yeah, simann, I think you may have seen some on the regular independent suspension honda used to have, but on this new setup, try installing it yourself...you won't see it like you are talking about. you'll only see it on the rear, not the front.

Failuretostop, I'm going to have to see if my instructions even had anything like that about the bumpstop, if I remember correctly it just gave me some clear plastic wrapping to put on the coils.

simann
02-03-2003, 09:35 PM
I had a 2001 Civic lx coupe which I traded for the Si. I put coilovers on , with the aide of my brother and my old friend.
YES I KNOW WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE. Most all bump stops look the same. Also I am in Auto Tech at my High school, in the best groupe, we just finished rebuilding a friends brother in laws Cavlier Z28 motor that had blown a head gasket. Made straight A's in all suspension catagory tests!

Any more Questions?:rolleyes:

ep3
02-03-2003, 09:40 PM
what color is it??? i pulled the dust covers out, but no bumpstop. it has to be in there still cuz the only thing i took off was the dust cover. dang now i gotta look for a bumpstop.

simann
02-03-2003, 09:42 PM
How hard is it to figure out? I tryin to help this man out and all I get is retarded questions!

Could you all explain a bump stop any better?
Remember my 2001 Civic has the EXACT same front and rear suspension setup! I think I remember after 6 long hours of coilover syndrome( setting the heigth etc....).

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:44 PM
Originally posted by simann
I had a 2001 Civic lx coupe which I traded for the Si. I put coilovers on , with the aide of my brother and my old friend.
YES I KNOW WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE. Most all bump stops look the same. Also I am in Auto Tech at my High school, in the best groupe, we just finished rebuilding a friends brother in laws Cavlier Z28 motor that had blown a head gasket. Made straight A's in all suspension catagory tests!

Any more Questions?:rolleyes:
relax! damn. I've done this 3 times, and never saw them. I've done the install on my 97 EX and I did see them, so I also know what they look like. 3 sources say they aren't there. maybe the 02 si is different than the lx? strange because even people on 7thgencivic would disagree.....
Failure to stop, progress didn't call for any trimming on my bumpstops.

ep3
02-03-2003, 09:46 PM
dude why you getting all bitter for???? i asking cuz i need your help too. i swear i didn't find nothin under them dust covers or anything that looks like bumpstops, so that must mean they still there. i need to get them out, but first i gotta know what they look like or what color they are cuz i don't know. what i thought was the bumpstop was the dust cover. so obviously i took out the wrong part. i know what it looks like but i did not find that donut shaped foam piece in the front.

simann
02-03-2003, 09:46 PM
Its right under the top pillow mount! under the bearing race! the 2001 civic's was yellow, I had to cut it in half when I droped my old civic 2 inches.

When you take the top compression bolt off, the pillow ball mount comes off. After that you WILL see the BUMP STOP. It can't hide from ya! It is meerly pressed on , by aid of a tapered edge on the strut rod!

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:49 PM
okay on hondatuning, they show the bump stop...that's not like what I've seen:
http://www.hondatuningmagazine.com/tech/0205ht_suspension_17_zoom.jpg
17. This little white plastic doodad is often overlooked, but its importance can't be overstated. If your strut bottoms out, the impact can actually seal the bump stop against the strut housing. When the suspension decompresses, that seal is broken, and it can actually create enough suction to break the seal on the strut itself. This piece of plastic creates an air gap between the bump stop and the strut, preventing this weird disaster from occurring.


Here you can see it under the dust cover...as I would call it
http://www.hondatuningmagazine.com/tech/0205ht_suspension_20_zoom.jpg

18. To make sure that the stock boot fits over the plastic anti-suck-the-strut-apart device, its lower lip was cut off.

http://www.hondatuningmagazine.com/tech/0205ht_suspension_18_zoom.jpg

This was all done during an install of konis

Here's the link: http://www.hondatuningmagazine.com/tech/0205ht_suspension/

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:50 PM
oh and here is what I am used to seeing, right above the koni shock is a bumpstop
http://www.hondatuningmagazine.com/tech/0205ht_suspension_24_zoom.jpg

simann
02-03-2003, 09:52 PM
What do ya know! There it is, the bump stop.I am not getting bitter, I'm sorry if I seemed mad. I dont get whats so hard?

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:53 PM
Originally posted by simann
Its right under the top pillow mount! under the bearing race! the 2001 civic's was yellow, I had to cut it in half when I droped my old civic 2 inches.

When you take the top compression bolt off, the pillow ball mount comes off. After that you WILL see the BUMP STOP. It can't hide from ya! It is meerly pressed on , by aid of a tapered edge on the strut rod!
hhhmmmm...strange that's not what you just explained when compared to these pics :rolleyes:

02SilverSiHB
02-03-2003, 09:54 PM
Originally posted by simann
What do ya know! There it is, the bump stop.I am not getting bitter, I'm sorry if I seemed mad. I dont get whats so hard?
yeah, you're talking about the rear one....we're talking about the front one....the rear is yellow, ther front isn't anywhere near to what you explain...which you were explaining the rear one :rolleyes:

simann
02-03-2003, 10:00 PM
I see you overlooked my point, the bump stop is meerly that. You cant miss it its so simple! ALL Struts on late model cars have bumpstops, whether on the bottom like the front (evidently), or like the rear ( a little yellow one on top ).
They all use the same principal of operation ( being on top or on the bottom ). From that you should conclude through visual analization that "hey this must be the bumpstop".

FailureToStop
02-03-2003, 10:13 PM
02Silver,

That's not the instruction sheet I am talking about. I wish I had a camera, but the sheet I am talking about is lime green (in my case) and it had the registration tear-off on it and boxes where you put your before and after measurements.

The sheet says:

"On strut equipped vehicles, any bump stops (compression stops) that are located on the strut piston rod (the chrome shaft comming out of the top of the strup or cartridge) should be trimmed in half to improve wheel travel and ride quality."

After looking at the picture on the Progress sheet, and the attached pictures, I'm leaning towards SiMan's dust cover ID.

ep3
02-03-2003, 10:13 PM
dang i hope simann is wrong only for the fact that the front was a bitch to do and i do not want to take that apart right now. damn tie rod ends are a pain in the ass. i hope someone posts a pic of that diagram in the helms manual so you can see why i said that piece was a bumpstop. but if he is correct, i apologize for saying that it's a bumpstop and making you guys go through all this trouble.

simann
02-03-2003, 10:18 PM
Its fine EP3, its positive controversy.The Helm manual probably does not show the strut shaft, just the " dust cover", the drawing( I presume) may not of included this piece, therefore causing this huge mess of ideas we wrote up? Its just a thought.:D

02SilverSiHB
02-04-2003, 09:39 AM
Originally posted by FailureToStop
02Silver,

That's not the instruction sheet I am talking about. I wish I had a camera, but the sheet I am talking about is lime green (in my case) and it had the registration tear-off on it and boxes where you put your before and after measurements.

The sheet says:

"On strut equipped vehicles, any bump stops (compression stops) that are located on the strut piston rod (the chrome shaft comming out of the top of the strup or cartridge) should be trimmed in half to improve wheel travel and ride quality."

After looking at the picture on the Progress sheet, and the attached pictures, I'm leaning towards SiMan's dust cover ID.
ah, maybe since I got my springs a while back, they didn't have those instruction included. So you neep to trim it in half. That would answer whe my ride quality can be irratic at times. I believe you, I'm definitely going to do that...but in about 6 months...I'm leaving real soon..........

02SilverSiHB
02-04-2003, 09:41 AM
Originally posted by simann
Its fine EP3, its positive controversy.The Helm manual probably does not show the strut shaft, just the " dust cover", the drawing( I presume) may not of included this piece, therefore causing this huge mess of ideas we wrote up? Its just a thought.:D
yeah, sorry man, it seemed like you were talking about something else at first. So now I know...I wish I had known it was there to begin with :p That's what I get for doing it with no instructions :) And why I didn't get anything about trimming the bumpstop, is beyond me...oh well.

FailureToStop
02-10-2003, 10:17 PM
Well I got the shop manual... and the black part that I am talking about is labeled as a "bump stop" --- as EP3 noted. From the exploded view of the strut assembly, there aren't any other parts that can be a bump stop other than this black piece that was left out.

And I've ridden on the Progress springs without this part and the little mini-ditches that you sometime see at an intersection would cause my car to thump. I'm gonna have to go back and have that tire place put these puppies back in.

Si02
02-15-2003, 01:53 PM
What the tire place have to say???

FailureToStop
02-15-2003, 02:18 PM
Well I went back and they did install the bumpstops in the initial install.

There was a discrepancy in what I found in the box of parts and the picture in the shop manual. The shop manual has a big disc on top of the part in question. The left-over part I had seemed to be only the bottom part. I think the whole problem with ID'ing this part was that the bump stop and the dust cover on the EP is one combined part.

What the shop did was to trim the part and only put the top portion (the bump stop) and left the dust cover part out. It was explained to me that this was done (i.e. leave out the dust cover) to increase the suspension travel. If the whole bumpstop/dustcover part was left as is, the suspension's travel would have been very short and trimming the bumpstop was actually mentioned in the Progress instruction sheet.

But they did find out that the installer left out the little rubber coil parts (part of the Progressive kit. 02Silver has a picture of the instructions for this part in this thread) that go around on the springs to stop/cushion the coil-to-coil slamming. They installed this part on the fronts and the jolt from bumps were noticeable better.

But I still think that they may have trimmed the part too much. If you guys are going to do the install, try trimming the bump stop/dustcover at the half point of the dustcover or just trimming the bottom ring of the part off (like it shows in the install pictures that 02Silver has posted on this thread).

simann
02-15-2003, 08:02 PM
The back Bumpstop/Dustcover is one piece. Thats great news that your place fixed your problem!:cool: