Thinking about doing a K24A1 Swap...

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Originally Posted by Ba82Ep3

HAHA! With no swaybar MAYBE. Have you swapped a k24... or are you spouting off what you have read/heard? ESMM's are MINIMAL for a k24 and really arent enough. They are a thin band-aid at best. A good clutch will hit ya right at $450+.

Here is where you concede and say... "Ok, well if i wanted to do it RIGHT, then 5k seems possible." Or you can agree that 3.5k is the way to half ass a k24 swap. The choice is yours...

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bs im on stock mounts with esmmi and im not buying shit till i brake one, and i get no wheel hop. i think weltall is also on them.

and you can get a CC stage 4 for about 380 and i got my type-s flywheel for 20 bucks.

for the swap all you need is
k24a1 $1300
oil,filter let say $30
coolant $5
if you need the clutch $380
lets say $60 for the most for a type-s fly wheel
passenger side mount that comes with daves engines.
then add your $1000 for bolt-ons
$850 for k-pro
and $25 for esmmi

=$3650 assuming you can do your own work
+a few hundred for a tune

hell for less the 5k you could also get a a2 head, gasket, and arp studs, and maybe a2 oil pump

or you can spend less then 4k and get a rev hard kit with k-pro and own the shit out of a k24a1 swap

Corners can always be cut if you wait long enough for the right seller and know your way around the biz. Doing your own labor saves tons of money but unless you do then there is little chance of getting a bolt on k24 for under 5g's without cuttins corners that you will regret later down the road.

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Originally Posted by Guardian

bs im on stock mounts with esmm and im not buying shit till i break one, and i get no wheel hop. i think weltall is also on them.

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I never said anything about wheel hop. :shrug:

Wheel hop is MOSTLY a driver issue... not SOLELY an engine mount issue... IMO anyways...

yup stock mounts with esmm

ive broken 1 mount and was able to replace it cheap

ill upgrade mounts when i do my tranny build in the winter


and yeah wheel hop= 50% tires 50% driver

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Originally Posted by davisj3537

Corners can always be cut if you wait long enough for the right seller and know your way around the biz. Doing your own labor saves tons of money but unless you do then there is little chance of getting a bolt on k24 for under 5g's without cuttins corners that you will regret later down the road.

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Said with nothing but TRUTH

Thanks guys I'm glad that I can always come to EPHATCH and know that I won't get flamed but supported. keep up the advice

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Originally Posted by Ba82Ep3

I was hardly being an asshole... just suggesting you were talking from yours. All i was askin is if you were typing facts from experience... or were concluding thoughts from the bazillions of threads available on the net on this very subject. You were the one spouting off what "was" and "was not" right. The rest of us mildly corrected you. Here you take offense.

By the way... a ClutchMasters stg4 clutch isnt a race clutch. It is still ony a single plate design with clamping loads much lower than what Racing Clutches have to offer. You commenting on a "whoppin 30 tq more" speaks volumes of your ingnorance.

Get your hands dirty with a k24 swap. Learn to use some dial calipers and what value a line bore has for you and your engine/build. THEN let us know your opinions... until then YOURE being the asshole. Incorrect information is not helping anyone at all... no matter how many times you try to defend your intent.

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The only thing that i should of been corrected on was that a dcrh had minor clearence issues. Which i was told by davis himself in another thread when i did ask about what header setup needs to be used on the swap. I also stated that the swap could be done for under 4k doin the work yourself and getting all necessary parts. Then you went on the offensive telling me i was wrong and cutting corners.

And if your implying that i dont know what i am talkin about when it comes to doing my own work then you are way wrong buddy.

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Originally Posted by Emerica459

The only thing that i should of been corrected on was that a dcrh had minor clearence issues. Which i was told by davis himself in another thread when i did ask about what header setup needs to be used on the swap. I also stated that the swap could be done for under 4k doin the work yourself and getting all necessary parts. Then you went on the offensive telling me i was wrong and cutting corners.

And if your implying that i dont know what i am talkin about when it comes to doing my own work then you are way wrong buddy.

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So um... after all that. Have you done a k24 swap? Just curious? :shrug:

I mean we can dance around for the rest of this threads existence if ya like. You still have yet to realize what my "quotes" should mean to you. Have you or have you not swapped a k24 into an EP... or even been remotely close to said event with so much as a screwdriver? OR. Has what you been typing on this thread been bits and pieces of what you have read or heard... and you are just passing off this "knowledge" in your comments?

"Theres a difference between knowing the path, and walking the path."

No implications here. I ask a question. You elude an answer. Take it for what you will. Just dont take it personal, and continue to wiggle out from under the proverbial rock by making this about ME.

Mkay?

Ill make a note on one thing, I did a K24a1 swap and sum what cut corners, and to be honest with you it has cost me a little over $4000. I wish I would have gotten KPro from the start.

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Originally Posted by Ba82Ep3

So um... after all that. Have you done a k24 swap? Just curious? :shrug:

I mean we can dance around for the rest of this threads existence if ya like. You still have yet to realize what my "quotes" should mean to you. Have you or have you not swapped a k24 into an EP... or even been remotely close to said event with so much as a screwdriver? OR. Has what you been typing on this thread been bits and pieces of what you have read or heard... and you are just passing off this "knowledge" in your comments?

"Theres a difference between knowing the path, and walking the path."

No implications here. I ask a question. You elude an answer. Take it for what you will. Just dont take it personal, and continue to wiggle out from under the proverbial rock by making this about ME.

Mkay?

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ok, we will end this now.

You are right, i have not swapped a K24 myself, i am stating what i have been told and read on here. I am fine with being corrected if something i say is not accurate information. This is after all a forum where people come to discuss our interests.

On the other hand I have much experience with motor swaps with other vehicles and wrenching in general. I know a thing or two about what is involved with undertaking such projects because i have done them before.

And hey, within the next year i will be "walking the path" so if have some inaccurate information then now is the time for me to find that out. Not when i have my car disassembled on my lift.

On that note, i apologize for taking this as far is it went.

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Originally Posted by Emerica459

ok, we will end this now.

You are right, i have not swapped a K24 myself, i am stating what i have been told and read on here. I am fine with being corrected if something i say is not accurate information. This is after all a forum where people come to discuss our interests.

On the other hand I have much experience with motor swaps with other vehicles and wrenching in general. I know a thing or two about what is involved with undertaking such projects because i have done them before.

And hey, within the next year i will be "walking the path" so if have some inaccurate information then now is the time for me to find that out. Not when i have my car disassembled on my lift.

On that note, i apologize for taking this as far is it went.

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Seriously... no need to aplogize. I guess one of my pet peeves is being the recipient of correct partial or just flat out inaccurate info. Not just here, but other sites as well. One of the things i do love about this site is it IS EP specific... so there is a higher chance someone has done what you wanna do... and he/shes either done it right OR wrong... both being a learning lesson for all interested. THAT is really why i pressed the swap issue. I too have swapped many an engine... not all k series... and not all hondas. General wrenching skills are also abundant round my way. So im there with ya... and certainly arent challenging your abilities by any means. But, even as often as the questions may be asked, it is up to all of us to try and provide accurate information.... just like we wanted when we originally had 5 posts, and thought a VAFC controller was a good purchase for our EP.

I hope you do swap a k24... you wont regret it. And contrary to what you may think about these past few interactions... if you asked, i would be one right under the hood helping you turn them wrenches. Its about the cars... and the people. And all the fun in between...

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Originally Posted by Ba82Ep3

Seriously... no need to aplogize. I guess one of my pet peeves is being the recipient of correct partial or just flat out inaccurate info. Not just here, but other sites as well. One of the things i do love about this site is it IS EP specific... so there is a higher chance someone has done what you wanna do... and he/shes either done it right OR wrong... both being a learning lesson for all interested. THAT is really why i pressed the swap issue. I too have swapped many an engine... not all k series... and not all hondas. General wrenching skills are also abundant round my way. So im there with ya... and certainly arent challenging your abilities by any means. But, even as often as the questions may be asked, it is up to all of us to try and provide accurate information.... just like we wanted when we originally had 5 posts, and thought a VAFC controller was a good purchase for our EP.

I hope you do swap a k24... you wont regret it. And contrary to what you may think about these past few interactions... if you asked, i would be one right under the hood helping you turn them wrenches. Its about the cars... and the people. And all the fun in between...

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He is not kidding...he helped me turn a few wrenches under my hood:hay:...ok it was between the sheets but whatever. I'm saying he doesn't mind helping out:gheyf:

Motor mounts have absolutely no impact on actual wheel hop what-so-ever!

Wheel hop is generated excusively at the tire/pavement contact point and is affected by suspension spring rates, both front and rear and tire traction.

With the stock mounts what you have is the header banging the swaybar and thump of the stock squishy mounts bottoming out. To keep the ESmm inserts from ripping you must apply some of the bushing grease used on their suspension bushings, use some and they will never rip.

end of story.

So what's the benefit of a motor mount upgrade?

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Originally Posted by davisj3537

He is not kidding...he helped me turn a few wrenches under my hood:hay:...ok it was between the sheets but whatever. I'm saying he doesn't mind helping out:gheyf:

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:orly:

:spit:


Doug... im not gonna say i disagree with you... but i will say engine mounts that move too much store and release energy (TQ) like a spring. If the mounts are too soft, when you apply the throttle the engine moves in the mounts and can then cause the engine to "pop" back like an undamped spring on a strut. This can break traction as the driveline compensates for the motion that was stored or "wound up" in the mounts. This CAN be controlled by the driver. If it isnt, then wheel hop IS a common result.

Harder mounts allow for quicker and more efficient shifting/use of power than any soft mount... or ESMM damped mount. It gives the driver a more connected feel with the driveline and its response to throttle input. This is moreso noticeable on NA cars than Turbo cars.

Turbo cars arent usually driven like an NA car... so a REASONABLY driven turbo car will store the energy in the mounts and be less likely to "pop" back (through driver control). Most turbo drivers will shift easier than the average NA guy, knowing they have power in the pull of the gear (why most turbo guys like the longer gear trannies)... while modulating the throttle to avoid wheelspin... versus banging out each gear as efficiently/fast as possible to get the most out of each gear.

Again, driver is primary here. As far as NA goes... harder engine mounts and a competent driver will net a faster time slip (strip or twisties), giving everything else is identical by comparison.

And this wont apply to AWD. AWD is actully a little better with a softer mount. It saves axles/drivetrain parts and will let you launch a little harder.

When i tracked my EP with the ESMM's, and i was static in a specific gear through a corner (lets just say 3rd), i could stab the throttle and feel the movement in the mounts cause a delay in feel of where the RPM's were. Rev matching through a corner (downshifting) could be tricky and somewhat of a guesstimation at times, being several hundred RPM off. This feel is very similar to the mental adjustment you have to make if you ever manually shift an older tiptronic style transmission. You have to shift a few hundred RPM before your desired shiftpoint, to compensate for the shifting delay. (older Mercedes AMG paddle shift trannies (E55 AMG comes to mind) were like this.. needing almost 500RPM of "notice" to get your desired shift, or it would shift FOR you as a safety) The more TQ the car has, revmatching (upshifting) through a corner can be seriously affected with soft mounts... the result either being wheelspin by adding too much throttle, or too little throttle causing you to "tuck in" too close to your mark through the turn. The much firmer engine mounts ARE harder on the axles/driveline, but throttle modulation and traction control are much easier IMO... if you are in sync with your car.

:typing: