Information on Alignment after Lowering

[Quicksilver]

I just got done dropping my car about 2" with Tein SS coilover, and thought I'd share my experience with the wheel alignment afterwards. The camber was noticibly negative on both the front and the rear. So I ordered up the front and rear Ingalls camber kits and dialed in a rough 0 degrees in the front with a little more negative in the rear. In just the brief period that I didn't have a camber kit, I wore a noticible inside wear on the tire. If I hadn't gotten the kit, the camber numbers below would probably be off by another -1 degree in the front and -2 degrees in the rear.

In driving around before I could get the alignment done, I noticed that the rear wheels had quite a bit of rubber dust buildup in the back, but not in the front. This was a sure indicator that the rear toe was way off. Just for reference, our rear wheels toe out when accelerating (or after being lowered) and toe in under braking.

Here are the before and after results of the alignment:

Before:
Front wheel camber: 0.2/-0.4 degrees (l/r)
Front wheel toe: 0.11"/0.03" (l/r)
Rear wheel camber: -0.9/-0.7 degrees (l/r)
Rear wheel toe: 0.17"/0.13" (l/r)

After:
Front wheel camber: 0.1/0.0 degrees (l/r)
Front wheel toe: 0.00"/0.01" (l/r)
Rear wheel camber: -0.8/-0.7 degrees (l/r)
Rear wheel toe: 0.04"/0.05" (l/r)

Specified Range: (preferably in the middle of the two numbers)
Front wheel camber: -0.8 to 0.8 degrees
Front wheel toe: -0.06" to 0.06"
Rear wheel camber: -1.5 to 0.0 degrees
Rear wheel toe: 0.02" to 0.08"

This shows that the rear toe was indeed severly outside the specified range and would cause uneven wear on the tires. Without the camber kits, I don't think they could have gotten the wheels withing spec either. I also noticed that a humming/vibrating sound I had coming from what seemed like the driver's side of the car before the alignment was gone afterwards.

So for all those posts that say, "Do I need a camber kit with a 2" drop?" or "Do I need to get an alignment after I lower my car?", the answer is a resounding "YES!!!". Unless you don't car about replacing tires more often that usual and annoying road noise. :D

Happy Motoring!
Kurtis

[myeverlovinsir]

Great post, thanks for the input. :D

[tkm]

Dude, camber is your friend in the front if you want a car than handles decently.

Basically, by having no camber anywhere, you will get a ton of miles out of your tires, but handling will suffer. Personally, I'd rather replace tires more often than have a car that handles like crap. If you don't believe me, take the car to an autox and watch as the car pushes through the turns like it's on ice. Mac strut cars do not gain camber when compressed like the double wishbone does. This is a double-whammy.

I'm shooting for 1.5 degrees negative front and 1 degree negative rear with my tein flex kit. This will be a compromise between decent handling and tirewear. If I want to push the car harder, I'll adjust the front to 2 degrees negative.


Honestly, your camber on the before settings is better than the camber on the after settings. On specified settings, I'd max out the camber numbers. You're still within oe spec, so might as well take advantage of it if you want tire life.

[Quicksilver]

Basically, by having no camber anywhere, you will get a ton of miles out of your tires, but handling will suffer. Personally, I'd rather replace tires more often than have a car that handles like crap. If you don't believe me, take the car to an autox and watch as the car pushes through the turns like it's on ice.

The nice thing about the Ingall front bolts (and other manufacturers as well) is that I can dial in more camber with just the twist of the upper strut bolts. I've currently got the bolt set to +1 degree camber, so if I turn it 180 degrees I should be at -2 degrees camber. If I ever want to go autoxing or road racing, I'll do that.

Without the kit, I was eating away at my inside front tires something fierce. I drive 70 miles round trip per day, so tire wear is important to me. My car also doesn't push as much as stock because I'm running the Progress rear sway bar. I really appreciate your feedback, but for my purposes I think my settings work well for me. Given more seat time, I may take your advise and dial it back a degree to get more bite.

[IceD out N CALI]

nice post and details of before/after. I dont have a camber kit myself but i'll live without it:)

[dchu]

The reason why your tires wore out so fast was because of toe. Toe kills tires much faster then camber. You don't need a camber kit to adjust toe, so I wouldn't say it's necessary for the rear. The rear hardly wears anyway. Your rear camber before is pretty good already. I would say the front camber kit is more necessary seeing as how unpredictable the front camber could be (you had + camber in front L).

[simann]

I am getting the Progress Springs PRETTY soon.
First: where did you get the Camber Kit?
Second: How much did it cost (total).

Last, every pic I see of an EP3 lowered roughly 2" the rear camber looks WAY off. So do I really nead to worry about the rear befor ethe front or what,? PLEASE CLARIFY!:(

[tkm]

If your camber is more than -1.5 in the rear, get a camber kit.

I absolutely would not worry about front camber after lowering. Unless, you want to induce *more* negative front camber to help with handling.

[Quicksilver]

I got the Ingalls camber kits from Group Buy Center . Import Auto Performance is the vendor selling them. $49 for two pair of front bolts giving you +2/-2 degrees of adjustment. The rears were $125 and give +3/-3 degrees of adjustment. Both prices include shipping.

Without the front, I probably would have had about -1 degree of negative camber. This is livable/preferable for some people, but I needed the tread life. I understand that the toe being slightly out in the front could have caused some of the additional inside wear, but one side was within spec before alignment and one was outside spec. Both, however, showed about the same inside wear. That's why I attribute the inside wear to the camber.

I don't claim to be an expert and I don't autocross or road race, but these are just my observations. There are many other people on here that know much more about suspension geometry than I do, so take my words for what you will.

[simann]

Thanks man! Thats great info!